Should New Diesel Cars and SUV's be restricted or banned..

[TER2BO]

I know this is going to cause a lot of discussion.
I refer to an article on P24 of Friday's Melbourne Herald -Sun.
The article refers to concern of our growing purchase of Diesel cars ,Suv's & Utes and the danger this poses.
The fact that Diesel is Carcinogenic (a cancer producing substance) and that sales of Diesel vehicles have been restricted in many European countries. Although they have much higher pollution controls and are as low as 20p per m. compared with our average of 50p per m.
The fact is we are buying more & more of these high polluting vehicles -Why??
I will put it to you that it stems from the view that Diesel's are more economical to run. Greater fuel economy, more range, torque and engines last longer.
About 20+ years ago when Diesels were noisy oil burners not many people would have considered them as everday transport.
Okay they have cleaned up their act somewhat but they will not necessary be more economic to run in the long term. Repairs are more expensive and as we import most if not all our diesel from overseas our prices are subject to overseas demand which is increasing as supplies diminish.
I believe that we need to restrict these sales before we once again become the dumping ground for overseas manufacturers who can't sell their diesel models in Europe and other markets.
We have access to one of the cleanest hydocarbon fuels in Australia which could also be the least expensive . Unfortunetly the powers to be have no vision of the future or your health and mine.

[vztrt]

If emmissions are your primary concern then cars that are older then 10 years should be deresistered. Any car that doesnt have oem parts should be taken off the road until its fixed. Then all need to have yearly emmission testing to comply with the regs. And finally bring forward emmission laws to be the most strict in the world.

Or you look at it that our air actually cleaner now then before and instead of the above we work on making our roads more efficient keeping less poeple on the road.

Btw i wouldnt buy a diesel but thats because i dont like the way they drive.

[Franco Cozzo]

The problems with diesels come from crap like diesel particulate filters, I've had multiple customers come to me with DPF lights on because they've bought diesel cars and then just used them on short trips to putt around home and town in.

I had a 2015 VW Golf come to me last year, DPF lasted a year before it was shagged because the salesman told her it would use less fuel than the petrol one, not covered under warranty because its a filter.

Then when you tell them its a few thousand bucks for a new DPF after you've tried multiple burn offs and taken it for a beating to clear it out more but its still shagged, they look at me like I'm the ***.

I've got a diesel Focus, I like how it drives, but its Euro IV and doesn't have a DPF, I'd buy diesel again if it didn't have a DPF but they all do now.

[TER2BO]

VZTRT,
It wasn't my article, but I agree we need to look into it before it becomes too late.
Also agree with your comment about the roads. I run a transport business in Melb. Everytime our vehicles are stuck in wall to wall traffic for an hour or so I think of the 10 thousand vehicles idling away using valuable resoures etc.
As an aside on some vehicles in Europe they now have auto shut down and restart when your stationary for more than a few seconds. From what discusssions I have seen the drivers hate it, but it looks like it will be compulsory soon.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by TER2BO

VZTRT,
It wasn't my article, but I agree we need to look into it before it becomes too late.
Also agree with your comment about the roads. I run a transport business in Melb. Everytime our vehicles are stuck in wall to wall traffic for an hour or so I think of the 10 thousand vehicles idling away using valuable resoures etc.
As an aside on some vehicles in Europe they now have auto shut down and restart when your stationary for more than a few seconds. From what discusssions I have seen the drivers hate it, but it looks like it will be compulsory soon.

You run a transport business, hope you not running clapped out old diesel burners like most transport companies do, another big problem! yeah you right on one thing we should not be a dumping ground but then again they are introducing stricter emission controls for diesels.

[OLD BALDY]

YES, they stink! it stinks, and motor noisy. Why pay more for a few extra NM's of Torque, when my Terri pulls the 2 tonne van quite quite nicely thanks.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by TER2BO

VZTRT,
It wasn't my article, but I agree we need to look into it before it becomes too late.
Also agree with your comment about the roads. I run a transport business in Melb. Everytime our vehicles are stuck in wall to wall traffic for an hour or so I think of the 10 thousand vehicles idling away using valuable resoures etc.
As an aside on some vehicles in Europe they now have auto shut down and restart when your stationary for more than a few seconds. From what discusssions I have seen the drivers hate it, but it looks like it will be compulsory soon.

Yeah I realise that, I'm just saying that the article really isn't well thought out.

Australia is different to Europe. We really don't have the population to be that concerned.

The other thing to keep in mind by 2020 car companies will be pushing their EV cars. While people say many things about them for the commuter that really does small km's (like the diesel drivers damo alluded to) if these cars are about the same in price people will buy more and more of them. Diesels as well as petrol motors will start to die out (from a new car perspective).

[Mercury Bullet]

Originally Posted by trublu

You run a transport business, hope you not running clapped out old diesel burners like most transport companies do, another big problem! yeah you right on one thing we should not be a dumping ground but then again they are introducing stricter emission controls for diesels.

Clapped out old diesel burners as you put it.

Have you ever seen what a modern EGR system does on new trucks?
Dumps 30 litres of raw fuel into the system...such economy/emissions when they start to play up and do a burn every couple of hours, or shutdown the engine on a triple when you're doing 110.

Give me an old GM 71 or 92 anyday. Or any old burner for that matter.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by Mercury Bullet

Clapped out old diesel burners as you put it.

Have you ever seen what a modern EGR system does on new trucks?
Dumps 30 litres of raw fuel into the system...such economy/emissions when they start to play up and do a burn every couple of hours, or shutdown the engine on a triple when you're doing 110.

Give me an old GM 71 or 92 anyday. Or any old burner for that matter.

Hahaha, agree with you, my comment was tongue & cheek, I was referring clapped old engines in which a lot of transport companies will still use in old trucks that are passed by their used date.

[DJR-351]

You can have my diesels when you pry them from my cold, dead hands!

[chevypower]

Love my 6.6L V8 diesel! But seriously I think the internal combustion engine is living on borrowed time.

[Psi-Pop]

You can keep your new tech diesels, I like my oil burners with mechanical pumps.

More smoke, more poke!

[TER2BO]

Yes ,we do run Diesel in our trucks but our older vehicles and smaller cars run LPG.
I haven't seen a replacement EV for medium/long haulage on the horizon.

Maybe the remaining diesel should be left to them so that you can get your essentials from the supermarket.

[Mercury Bullet]

Toll were running a couple of Kenworths over here that were on CNG, not sure if they still have them.

[Sabantien]

If other countries start restricting them, we won't need to, because car companies will stop producing them.

The small turbo petrol motors seem to be doing fantastic when it comes to fuel economy anyhow, so they may stop bothering in any case.

[EBSXR6]

Originally Posted by Sabantien

If other countries start restricting them, we won't need to, because car companies will stop producing them.

The small turbo petrol motors seem to be doing fantastic when it comes to fuel economy anyhow, so they may stop bothering in any case.

The small turbo petrol motors may be a relic as they have will have trouble meeting the new emissions testing regime.

[Bill M]

Australian car owners turning away from diesel engines

https://www.whichcar.com.au/car-advi...diesel-engines

[chizzy86]

Modern diesels (without a DPF) are fantastic. My parents Sorento 2.2 diesel (145 kw and 445 nm 6 speed auto) drives really well for an SUV. The main let down of the car is the suspension, but the power train is excellent. Kills the equivalent petrol 3.3 v6.

[monzie]

Originally Posted by trublu

Hahaha, agree with you, my comment was tongue & cheek, I was referring clapped old engines in which a lot of transport companies will still use in old trucks that are passed by their used date.

And the main reason for this is the freight rates are so low they can't afford any thing newer.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

The problems with diesels come from crap like diesel particulate filters, I've had multiple customers come to me with DPF lights on because they've bought diesel cars and then just used them on short trips to putt around home and town in.

I had a 2015 VW Golf come to me last year, DPF lasted a year before it was shagged because the salesman told her it would use less fuel than the petrol one, not covered under warranty because its a filter.

Then when you tell them its a few thousand bucks for a new DPF after you've tried multiple burn offs and taken it for a beating to clear it out more but its still shagged, they look at me like I'm the ***.

I've got a diesel Focus, I like how it drives, but its Euro IV and doesn't have a DPF, I'd buy diesel again if it didn't have a DPF but they all do now.

Some manufacturers though will cover a DPF failure under warranty because it isn't listed as a serviceable item in the maintenance schedule. Case in point my X-Trail, if it came with a DPF, it would be replaced on failure. However, being Euro4, it doesn't have one.

[superyob]

Originally Posted by OLD BALDY

YES, they stink! it stinks, and motor noisy. Why pay more for a few extra NM's of Torque, when my Terri pulls the 2 tonne van quite quite nicely thanks.

Have to agree with this. The torque argument may have been relevant when your average car had a 3 speed auto or 4/5 speed manual box. I believe 1st in a C4 auto is 2.46:1? Modern 6 speed autos have a wide spread of ratios as do modern manuals. Case in point: My 2015 Kuga Trend has 230/40 hp, probably about the same as my standard 302W with extractors and C4 auto. The 302 has something like 100 foot pound of torque more than the turbo 2 litre yet cannot match its performance in acceleration or ease of towing due to the lower ratios available to the 2 litre...

[Ansimp]

We do reasonable distance per year so when it came time to replace our 2010 Diesel Premium Forester a new Diesel Premium CVT Outback was our preferred choice.



We have owned a lot of Subarus over the years and the 2010 Diesel Forester was a replacement for her 2007 Forester that was stolen. My 2004 Forester was stolen as well and this is a picture of our replacement vehicles together as I replaced mine with a 2007 Forester the same as her stolen one. I was never a fan of buying second hand diesel vehicles because it important that they have been well maintained. In this case it was an ex Vic Gov car with high Ks (162K Klms in Sep 2013) and a service history that was the right price. I did have DPF burn issues but I was able to get the software updated and everything was fine for about 12 months. I had picked up a 2nd hand low K DPF with the intention of changing it when necessary. I also ended up with the EGR valve as well. I replaced both and had the parameters reset to show a new DPF had been installed. We have now put over 100K Ks on the Diesel and my wife loves it and is still favouring it over her new Outback atm. Doh!

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by EBSXR6

The small turbo petrol motors may be a relic as they have will have trouble meeting the new emissions testing regime.

More info please? this doesn't look right.

[Matty4]

Originally Posted by TER2BO

I haven't seen a replacement EV for medium/long haulage on the horizon.

https://nikolamotor.com/one

[The Stylist]

I hate (I mean like) diesel so much, my 4th Gen Legacy (liberty) GT-B is making way for an 2016 Mazda6 2.2 Limited. With 129kw and 420Nm - it has more useable torque than the Subaru could ever offer. There's still life left in modern oil burners.

[blueoval]

Id take a Diesel car next no problems, but I dont do the km's to justify it and I dont want DPF problems which a lot of people who buy diesels are ignorant to.

I want an SUV next but a petrol turbo one with decent poke. The reason for me is due to the amount of times I go off road for photo shoots. I need it to look professional as well as handle the times unsealed roads come about. Something the liberty isnt really built for.

[Ansimp]

Originally Posted by The Stylist

I hate (I mean like) - it has more useable torque than the Subaru could ever offer. There's still life left in modern oil burners.

I am a little confused as even though the Subaru single turbo 2lt has only 350nm of torque it is available from 1600 rpm where the Mazda 2.2 max torque is from 2000 rpm. With the CVT anything near 1600 rpm and you have maximum acceleration from the Subaru.

[The Stylist]

Originally Posted by Ansimp

I am a little confused as even though the Subaru single turbo 2lt has only 350nm of torque it is available from 1600 rpm where the Mazda 2.2 max torque is from 2000 rpm. With the CVT anything near 1600 rpm and you have maximum acceleration from the Subaru.

Not sure you're quite correct there. The current 2.0L WRX makes 197kW of power at 5,600rpm and maximum torque of 350Nm at 2,400rpm-5,200rpm.

My 07 GT-B is asleep from under 2,600rpm and only starts getting into its stride when the needle swings around to the 3,400rpm mark - from there, loose contents migrate from the front into the back fairly rapidly.

The Mazda6 2.2 SkyactivD unit is much more flexible and effortless compared to my wagon - then there is the benefit of diesel fuel economy (5.4L/100km for the M6 versus 10.9L/100km for my departing Subaru.

[Burnout]

Real oil burning:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6GVapVrEUo

[Ansimp]

Originally Posted by The Stylist

Not sure you're quite correct there. The current 2.0L WRX makes 197kW of power at 5,600rpm and maximum torque of 350Nm at 2,400rpm-5,200rpm.

My 07 GT-B is asleep from under 2,600rpm and only starts getting into its stride when the needle swings around to the 3,400rpm mark - from there, loose contents migrate from the front into the back fairly rapidly.

The Mazda6 2.2 SkyactivD unit is much more flexible and effortless compared to my wagon - then there is the benefit of diesel fuel economy (5.4L/100km for the M6 versus 10.9L/100km for my departing Subaru.

I though we were talking about diesels as in our new 2lt Diesel CVT Premium Outback.