Buying a used FPV or HSV

[fordomatic]

So I have been looking for a V8 manual in either a BF GT or VZ/VE Clubsport now for 5 months.

I've looked at a few cars and nothing has come up in great condition yet. What is really interesting is the prices. Most cars have been on carsales for months now and literally nothing is selling. I thought that if nothing was selling prices would go down but it's the opposite, prices seem to be going up. The price for a VZ Clubsport in great condition is 26k, two months ago it was 20-22k you can get a great condition E series HSV for 28.

Then onto BF GT's, none have come up for sale on carsales now for 2 months, but the 5 that are in VIC and ACT have been on there for 3 months.

It's got me wondering if people are holding onto them because of the factories closing? For those that want sell they don't seem to be selling anyway, maybe they are trading in? I truly did not think it would take me this long to find something nice in my price range. It did take me 4 months to find my current FGXR6T 4 years ago but that was because i was very specific with what i wanted. I am quite open with what i would like now.

[Shonky.]

wife says sell car

husband lists car for 1.5 times its value

then goes back to enjoying car

[CobraJet351]

People hold on to them because they are good cars, and they won't get much better for the price. It would be silly if prices go up after the closure.

[ebv8]

low ball them, i did and got my GT cheap, i got $4500 off the asking price
or just go for a BA not a BF or a VY
if your keeping it for a while (10 years plus) you won't lose a cent on a BA even after maintainance costs
eg; good BA for $18k will still be worth at least $18k in 10 years while a $25k BF will be about the same price as a BA in 10 years....thats just my opinion though and really just a guess

[commodorenutt]

I'm getting real sick of hearing "my XYZ" will be collectable and worth heaps when the factory closes/now the factory has closed"

Just about every pub in every town has some toothless fool claiming he's got the inside tip on how to make a fast buck, and that's to hang onto your Ford or Holden as it will be worth an absolute motza once the Aussie public wake up to the reality of no local manufacturing.

And there's always someone willing to listen to them, and invest in their latest get-rich-quick scheme.....

Problem is, once a few fools believe it, the disease spreads.....

[Stefan]

People are simply in denial about what their cars are worth, FPV GT owners are probably the one of the worst...way over priced and none are selling. And plenty post on here complaining the market is dead...ummm no it's not, you are just asking too much.

F6 owners seem to be a closer to reality, I picked up my BF F6 R-spec with 50,000kms on it for $25K.

BF GT Cobra or GT40 they'd be asking $50 - $100K, but in reality they are not worth any more than my BF F6 R spec.

[raised by monkeys]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

The price for a VZ Clubsport in great condition is 26k, two months ago it was 20-22k you can get a great condition E series HSV for 28

What stopped you getting one then? or were you holding out for a BF GT?
I get the feeling that newer generation GT owners hold their vehicle against the badge and try to sit amongst the pre-BA (or even EB/EL) group with the same badge.
I find (although mainly FB mechanics) a lot of XR6t owners want pay nothing for their XR6t cars and parts, but say cause they make as much/more power this should be reflected in their sale price.
Us elitist F6 owners are a reasonable bunch.


A fella in Adelaide sent me a message the other week with a clean manual VZ clubsport with 85thou kms, to swap my tornado. But is asking 24k sell price, if you want the details.

[scoupedy]

I saw a 2002 GTO coupe with 44000k going for $12000 in the courier mail it was advertised for three weeks. if I didn't hate crapodoors so much I would have bought it.
Meanwhile my in-laws have bought a VN HSV SS?!! and a HSV VP for ~$12k thinking they are a good investment
Who is going to want a de tuned 5l when you could get a 5.7l gen 1 VT Coupe ?

[qdda5]

2002 GTO for 12k? You still have the add. Surely there was something wrong with it. Otherwise someone scored a major bargain

[ebv8]

when i was GT shopping I could have got a VT Coupe from $12-18k and a silly6 version for $8k when the BA GT's where about $18k, now the BA GT's are about $14k and the VT Coupes are about $18-25k
i should have bought the Monaro but i couldn't justify a stock 235kw LS1 in a VX body for that much money when the BA GT was the better car. i'm still happy to have the GT but would be nice to have a V2 Monaro in the driveway too

[fordomatic]

Originally Posted by raised by monkeys

What stopped you getting one then? or were you holding out for a BF GT?
I get the feeling that newer generation GT owners hold their vehicle against the badge and try to sit amongst the pre-BA (or even EB/EL) group with the same badge.
I find (although mainly FB mechanics) a lot of XR6t owners want pay nothing for their XR6t cars and parts, but say cause they make as much/more power this should be reflected in their sale price.
Us elitist F6 owners are a reasonable bunch.


A fella in Adelaide sent me a message the other week with a clean manual VZ clubsport with 85thou kms, to swap my tornado. But is asking 24k sell price, if you want the details.

Yeh I have been holding out for a BF GT but every time one comes up it just hasn't been maintained. The ones that have been maintained are asking 30+k and that just isn't what i'm willing to pay. I don't want a BA as I love the BF shape.

An E series HSV for 28k in my opinion is damn good buying. Selling my 2010 FGXRT for say 18k and then paying an extra 12k for a BF GT that is less refined and 5 years older isn't as appealing.

Originally Posted by ebv8

low ball them, i did and got my GT cheap, i got $4500 off the asking price

I worry about low balling as when I am selling a car and someone low balls me I tell them where to go. In saying that I always price my cars to sell and have always got my asking price.

[ebv8]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

I worry about low balling as when I am selling a car and someone low balls me I tell them where to go. In saying that I always price my cars to sell and have always got my asking price.

there are ways to politely low balling, but you can sense the mood of the seller and motivations they have to sell it. use all the information to your advantage.

[Express]

Originally Posted by scoupedy

I saw a 2002 GTO coupe with 44000k going for $12000 in the courier mail it was advertised for three weeks. if I didn't hate crapodoors so much I would have bought it.
Meanwhile my in-laws have bought a VN HSV SS?!! and a HSV VP for ~$12k thinking they are a good investment
Who is going to want a de tuned 5l when you could get a 5.7l gen 1 VT Coupe ?

Cars over time get more power and better features so I don’t see why the engine output would be the divining factor when it comes to choosing a classic.

I hope everyone thinks like you and junks the old SS Commodores because they don’t have a 5.7 litre oil burner.

I’d be more than happy to have a manual VN HSV Enhanced SS in my garage as I can’t see it being worth more or less than many of the other common mass produced performance cars already mentioned in threads like this one.

[Whitey-AMG]

B series have been around now since 2003 for BA and 2005 for BF....
The majority have been around the block a few times and driven , not hidden so it's no surprise that many are lacking a bit of sparkle and shine. Reminds me of the XB GT when I was looking to get one 20 odd years ago. Majority were down trodden , rusty neglected Junkers with heaps of klms on them.

Suffice to stay if you're looking for a minter then be prepared to pay.
Or
Get a BF GT in your price range and lavish some time and a bit of coin on it to get it to where you want it while you have a chance and most parts still readily available. Waiting for the right price / colour / condition car could take you forever... Every year that passes there will be less that meet your expectation and you've lost another year enjoying what you want.

Going forward it won't be the "buy price" that will go up for these cars , will probably go down more and then stabilise , it will be the restoration and maintenance costs that will make FPV cars ridiculous to own...

[Sabantien]

Haggling over a car is a time honoured tradition. They could have priced high, expecting to be low balled, then come to a reasonable value in the middle.

I don't think newer cars will hold, or regain, value like old cars. All the electronics, etc, it's not so simple to replace and there likely won't be an aftermarket. (Certainly a friend whose family business is selling spares seems to think anything reasonably modern won't be driveable in a few years), so I'd say if you really want an fpv, find one you can afford (or haggle one down), fix what needs fixing and drive it at every opportunity!

[bangm001]

The FPVs/Fords are fairly simple in regards to electronic compared to some Euro stuff.
Keep looking, keep asking on the forum etc. Good examples are rare but will occasionally apear. Just be ready. Are you fussy with Auto/Manual colour etc? Ask what your after here and if someone is willing or was considering selling then they can PM you?

[FPV6]

Originally Posted by commodorenutt

I'm getting real sick of hearing "my XYZ" will be collectable and worth heaps when the factory closes/now the factory has closed"

Just about every pub in every town has some toothless fool claiming he's got the inside tip on how to make a fast buck, and that's to hang onto your Ford or Holden as it will be worth an absolute motza once the Aussie public wake up to the reality of no local manufacturing.

And there's always someone willing to listen to them, and invest in their latest get-rich-quick scheme.....

Problem is, once a few fools believe it, the disease spreads.....

Mate a cars is worth what some will pay for it, end of story

Right, wrong

When there are not that many around and there are followers of that model price goes up simple right

here is where it get to the point where one can argue will there be fellows in the next generation kids

[FPV6]

Originally Posted by qdda5

2002 GTO for 12k? You still have the add. Surely there was something wrong with it. Otherwise someone scored a major bargain

depends could have been rough as

[fordomatic]

Originally Posted by bangm001

Are you fussy with Auto/Manual colour etc? Ask what your after here and if someone is willing or was considering selling then they can PM you?

Yeh i'm being pretty fussy, i have a thread in cars wanted. Needs to be manual, less than 100,000km, well looked after and not black or silver. I have looked at a few now that claim to be in great condition priced between 20-28k and all but one had been flogged or neglected. The other one was great but then the buyer chose not to sell. I dont think I am dreaming with a budget of 25k as when I was away overseas with work and looking 3 came up in the space of two weeks and were advertised for 23-24.

Hot tip as well, dont try and sell a car and provide your first and last name and have your facebook profile of your BF GT doing a burnout

Originally Posted by FPV6

Mate a cars is worth what some will pay for it, end of story

Right, wrong

And thats the thing they are not selling, there is a BF GT here in Canberra for 20k that needs about 2k spent on it to make it roadworthy. It's been on carsales now for 5 months. It's not a bad car, just not the condition im after. There is also a VE Clubsport in VIC in excellent condition that I looked at, its mint and has been for sale at 28 for 4 months. If I liked silver it would be in my garage now.

People just don't seem to be buying them.

[FPV6]

Not all cars will be worth a mint

My wife got the con job about the whole aspect that sprints are going to be worth a heap you know the one, we still speculate it here

So she bought both the 8 and the 6 the 8 she paid RRP the 6 she paid below RRP and top things off the 6 is number 496 and built in the final weeks both are for sale for the right price

My point is this i have a rare 71 Mach 1 mustang numbers matching not molested not as rare as a boss but most sort after colour its a 45 year car its worth $40k tops a 70 is worth $70k and a 69 $90kish in the same condition followers increase the price

My mates dad has held on to Brock director since new thinking its going to be worth $300k one day specially when Brocky died and noop its $80k on a good day perhaps if holds onto if for another 20 years but will there be followers that is point

thanks for the rant, sorry Im going of the topic

[FTW-302]

A friend of mine waited 2 years I believe to find a BF GT that got all the ticks from him, patience is the key.
They are great cars.

[b2tf]

Supply and demand comes into it, I was only thinking the other day that back in the mid 2000's there were easily 10-15 B series GT's running around where I live, maybe double that amount of VZ/VE HSV's, now I hardly see any. So it makes you wonder are they all in sheds somewhere, or have they filtered down to what the E series is at now, mostly P platers doing stupid stuff to cars cos they're cheap.

I am looking to get a T3 TS50 within the next 2 years, do i think it will be hard to get one after that well yes I do. No doubt the closures have impacted on things (I think the HSV one will really make big changes to the industry as it is far and away the most well known brand of its type) but it certainly isnt to the effect that some people think it has.

[STEALTHY]

For 25k you should easily find a decent one. I got my GTP for 29, so about 4k less for a GT of the same equivalent (low k's and not thrashed) should be reasonable

I actually found mine by chatting to a guy in the carpark at all ford day, happened to be selling it when his mustang arrived (around now), but he saw i was genuine with cash so we did a deal that week and he said he'd buy a runabout.

Having said that, i test drove a GT when i couldnt find any GTPs for sale, he wanted 32k and it was crap condition (and had dodgy ownership) so you'll always have the dreamers

[Angeldust]

I had my vy ss and in my mind I always had this urge to upgrade it to a VZ clubbie. It was always there in the back of my head, but I figured if the right car comes up I will consider it.
And one day there it was, I went to get the ss serviced at my regular holden dealer, and just happened to walk through their yard while waiting to get picked up.

[Iggle Piggle]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

I dont think I am dreaming with a budget of 25k as when I was away overseas with work and looking 3 came up in the space of two weeks and were advertised for 23-24.

Please tell me you contacted those sellers and told them you were interested in buying their cars but you were working offshore...etc

[fordomatic]

Originally Posted by Iggle Piggle

Please tell me you contacted those sellers and told them you were interested in buying their cars but you were working offshore...etc

i actually bought the wifes Outlander while i was away for 6 months last time. I saw it come up pretty cheap so I put an even sillier offer in knowing they wanted to sell and they said yes. Then they thought it was a scam so i had to get my wife to go over to the house to explain it was real

[Mesa]

It's doubtful many people can accurately speculate the future collect-ability or worth of the second generation muscle cars. Few could perceive in the late 70's/ early 80's when the first generation muscle cars were readily available second hand the type of money being asked now. If they could have I'm sure plenty more experts would've hidden more away or salvaged wrecks. In the early 80's I was told by the president of popular car club that a XA GT RPO coupe will never be worth anything over a couple of grand. 'They're only good for engine parts'... As for four door GTS/GT's, why would you bother? I bet Lahood Motors heard from plenty of experts that the Phase IV on their lot isn't worth 20k and never will be.

History is almost repeating itself with the second generation muscle cars. Unappreciated 10+ years after release by the same type of people who thought first generation muscle cars were worthless back then. Unless you own a time travelling De-Lorean, you can only speculate based on the previous history of the muscle car market. Nobody accurately knows.

[XRturbo69]

Just wait out for the right car mate, have patience. I don't know if you remember but a while back i was looking for an xr50 turbo, same deal i was fussy, had to be black, under 110,000kms. All of the 50ths that came up were either the wrong colour or asking way more that what they're worth. I budgeted for just over 20k which was more than reasonable and i remember you telling me to basically stick to my budget and the right one will come up. I was about 11 months into the search when i finally got a notification that another black xr50t had come up on carsales in vic, as soon as i opened it up, had a dreamer pricetag on it. I got ****ed off basically saying "**** that, for that much i can get an F6". Put FG F6s in the search tab, a black one had just been put up, ridiculously good price, one owner, basically wanted a quick sale as he'd just bought a new mustang. A week later it was in my driveway. I guess what I'm trying to say is, just wait for the right one mate. A wise man told me that once

[Stefan]

Originally Posted by Daz290

In the early 80's I was told by the president of popular car club that a XA GT RPO coupe will never be worth anything over a couple of grand. 'They're only good for engine parts'... As for four door GTS/GT's, why would you bother?

Was it the president of the Monaro club?

[Mesa]

Originally Posted by Stefan

Was it the president of the Monaro club?

No. A Ford Falcon one.