W427 between $148,000 - $168,000 - Page 6

WindsorXR · 20-06-2008, 06:24 PM

They will sell. HSV types are pretty loyal and the price of them will only go up.
I think I'd rather buy a Typhoon and then fully rebuilt the engine to whoop the HSV anus at half the price, twice the style and power!!

Nikked · 20-06-2008, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucket

Oh Im sure it will sell but Value for money it FAILS

yep, thats about right.

4Vman · 20-06-2008, 06:30 PM

Not sure how anyone can make a judgement call about "value for money" when no one has you driven one yet.. or knows all its performance numbers and features...?? I can tell you they're selling like hot cakes and go like the clappers..
But as usual the know it all arm chair critics with barely a few years driving experience let alone the ability to own one know better...

CADSKY · 20-06-2008, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan635

"Dis dat W247 fing huh?! I got a posta of it from da motashow ... what a roket of a car. I like da red interia braaah. Will u have my missus' babies?"

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHA

EXECJIM · 20-06-2008, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by schnoods

All that in a Fourdoor at that too. Even HRT 427 was at least a coupe.

Who would have thought that a 4 door car could be a "muscle car"

Maybe except for Bill Bourke.

philstoj · 20-06-2008, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Not sure how anyone can make a judgement call about "value for money" when no one has you driven one yet.. or knows all its performance numbers and features...?? I can tell you they're selling like hot cakes and go like the clappers..
But as usual the know it all arm chair critics with barely a few years driving experience let alone the ability to own one know better...

LOL, well said.

da_ilks · 20-06-2008, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summoner

why everyone crying over the price? Fact is if ford released a GT-HO at that price point and it actually had performance to match ford nuts would be falling over themselves to buy it if they could afford it.

Well said, was thinking the exact same thing myself. I hope if FPV ever get into this area of 'supercar' all the naysayers in this thread slag that car off as well. People who buy these will be investors - they'll do 1000km's a year and park it in the garage the rest of the time.

BTW - the AMG might have better resale in the short term, but considering how much GTHO's, Brock's etc have increased in value over the year I'm tipping it wouldn't take too long for the W427 to surpass and keep on climbing...

Miller · 20-06-2008, 10:50 PM

For that sort of money you can buy a second hand Ferrari F355 GTS...I know which I'd be buying

Nikked · 20-06-2008, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miller

For that sort of money you can buy a second hand Ferrari F355 GTS...I know which I'd be buying

mmm, much nicer.

WASP · 20-06-2008, 11:05 PM

As a FPV man would I buy one? (not likely). If I was a HSV enthusiast however it would be at the top of my list. Well done for making such a machine. For now an AMG C63 for similar money would be my preference but that's only because AMG is my other favourite performance brand. With any of these cars the value is in the eye of the beholder.

Auslandau · 20-06-2008, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summoner

why everyone crying over the price? Fact is if ford released a GT-HO at that price point and it actually had performance to match ford nuts would be falling over themselves to buy it if they could afford it.

I would beg to differ! FORD would be nuts if they offered something like this for that asking price. I think it is laughable, more so that there are so many cashed up bogans that will buy it! All balls no doubt but no class!

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Bossxr8 · 20-06-2008, 11:50 PM

Based on HSV's past history, give it 5 years and Clubsports will probably be making that much power, and the 427 will be worth less than a quarter of its selling price ala GTS 300.

I don't think anyones saying its a piece of junk, if it sold for what its really worth I don't think anyone would complain but the fact is that HSV are using this car as a cash grab, they said it themselves that they would push the price as high as what people would pay for it, not sell it for what it costs to design and build. They tried to cover that up a bit later by saying that the imported components from the US would cost a bomb because of the high aussie dollar, but that makes absolutely no sense as the high aussie dollar would make it heaps cheaper to import bits from the US. There was even a letter writing into the Carsguide asking them how that could be.

Bossxr8 · 20-06-2008, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoreSlamR

It will sell a lot better than you think.

No it won't, they only want to build small numbers. Doesn't matter how many potential orders they get if they can't build anymore than 200 over the next 2 years. Thats small potatoes.

Nikked · 21-06-2008, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Based on HSV's past history, give it 5 years and Clubsports will probably be making that much power, and the 427 will be worth less than a quarter of its selling price ala GTS 300.

I don't think anyones saying its a piece of junk, if it sold for what its really worth I don't think anyone would complain but the fact is that HSV are using this car as a cash grab, they said it themselves that they would push the price as high as what people would pay for it, not sell it for what it costs to design and build. They tried to cover that up a bit later by saying that the imported components from the US would cost a bomb because of the high aussie dollar, but that makes absolutely no sense as the high aussie dollar would make it heaps cheaper to import bits from the US. There was even a letter writing into the Carsguide asking them how that could be.

Spot on, the engineering of the 427. different colour leather and a new bumper don't justify somthing twice as much as a GTS. HSV change bumper's every 2 years, along with wheels...The VT GTS 300 had a special interior, and a increase of perfomance for a good price. Even the T3 FTE's with their hand built strokers had a reasonable price.

**DJM83** · 21-06-2008, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Not sure how anyone can make a judgement call about "value for money" when no one has you driven one yet.. or knows all its performance numbers and features...?? I can tell you they're selling like hot cakes and go like the clappers..
But as usual the know it all arm chair critics with barely a few years driving experience let alone the ability to own one know better...

So you have drivin one i take it? Come on put us all to rest and give us the details

Auslandau · 21-06-2008, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Not sure how anyone can make a judgement call about "value for money" when no one has you driven one yet.. or knows all its performance numbers and features...?? I can tell you they're selling like hot cakes and go like the clappers..
But as usual the know it all arm chair critics with barely a few years driving experience let alone the ability to own one know better...

No I havn't driven and proberly wont either, even though I would love too. Dont care if its a 10 second, with every concievable push button deluxe thingys with 4 cup holder, I can beat everything, go mobile. Its an overly dressing up fibreglass clad GM with a ridiculous price, even if they sell 500 of them. There is just to many other cars in this price group that have proved themselves to be worthy.

In a couple of years there will be more VT's driving around with W427 spoiler kits anyway .......

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**DJM83** · 21-06-2008, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by auslandau

No I havn't driven and proberly wont either, even though I would love too. Dont care if its a 10 second, with every concievable push button deluxe thingys with 4 cup holder, I can beat everything, go mobile. Its an overly dressing up fibreglass clad GM with a ridiculous price, even if they sell 500 of them. There is just to many other cars in this price group that have proved themselves to be worthy.

In a couple of years there will be more VT's driving around with W427 spoiler kits anyway .......

But you have to have drvin one to have an opinion dont you know that

: See below

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

But i can tell you they're selling like hot cakes and go like the clappers..
But as usual the know it all arm chair critics with barely a few years driving experience let alone the ability to own one know better...

Falc'man · 21-06-2008, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadMac

Heres where some of the cost/delay is? It would be the same for Ford for those contemplating a GTHO with something special (a supercharger would have been so much easier).
http://www.carpoint.com.au/Story/New...s/2933042.aspx

Quote:

Originally Posted by carpoint

As part of the W427 program, HSV has to find homes for 200 LS3s

HSV's first high performance model, where the whole drivetrain has to be 'scrapped', the W427, could be a boon for hotrodders.

Before HSV can install its hottest-ever drivetrain, the donor cars' LS3 V8 and gearbox must be removed. The problem has arisen after trial assemblies of fitting the 7.0-litre LS7 engine and matching gearbox on Holden's assembly line at Elizabeth succeeded, then had to be abandoned.

This has become one of the main challenges in setting a final price for the new W427, when the 'disposal' value of the latest LS3 engine and gearbox is yet to be determined

Because the LS7 has a complex dry sump oiling installation that could not be installed until each car arrived at HSV, HSV engineers had devised a temporary wet sump that allowed the LS7 engine to be installed on the Holden production line so each car could be started and driven as required by Holden during the manufacturing process.

Now, under the added pressure on the Elizabeth line, due to extra export orders for Pontiac, the whole process had to be scrapped.

According to Holden insiders, the prospect of up to six special-build W427 models per week bringing the whole assembly process to a halt due to any unexpected problem was something that Holden could no longer contemplate.

HSV was too far down the track to abandon the W427 project and has since been forced to establish a new specific build area staffed by experienced technicians. This in turn generated a recruitment drive to replace them as other areas of HSV are flat-out meeting a three-month order bank. Can hear the cash registers ringing?

Why couldn't Holden simply send HSV an empty shell for HSV to complete? It doesn't work like that.

HSV has to submit a special build sheet for its core vehicles just like for any other model that Holden builds. Once that is locked in, the manufacturing system is geared to meet HSV's special requirements. With Holden now catering for more export markets and body styles, there is a limit on how many variations can be processed. They say it wasn't cost effective for a new build specification for just four to six cars per week.

One of the big achievements of the Callaway engine program for HSV's VTII HSV GTS 300 (HSV's last special low-volume hero model) was that HSV, Holden and Callaway found a way of inserting the completed Callaway engines into the pipeline of LS1 powertrains on their way to Australia ready to be fitted on the Elizabeth production line.

In total contrast, every W427 will leave Holden as a GTS complete with LS3 engine and T56 manual gearbox that will have to be removed then sold as 'slightly' used parts without warranty. Negotiations are still underway as to how this will happen.

One of the issues still to be decided is whether to split the engine and transmission and sell each as separate units to different engine and transmission specialists.

While the prospect of re-powering another vehicle with a 317kW V8 sounds tantalising, it is no longer so easy. The wiring and electronics needed to support the new engine (including calibrations specific to its new home) can add a hefty premium to the cost of the engine itself.

Until this issue is resolved, HSV is still doing the sums before committing to a final W427 retail figure and production run.

The reason HSV are ripping people off is because of this ^^^^

They're getting a crate motor, where the only development dollars are to make it (the 7L) fit. However they couldn't get it right so the cost blew out.

tex · 21-06-2008, 03:29 PM

You can buy a seat into the Veyron for that money.

Time share, (about 20 days a year I think) with an ongoing service cost of 9k per annum fixed.

Only trouble is, the thing can't be driven on Aus roads legally and you'll need to fly to Europe to thrash the beast for the first 12 months of 'ownership" before they relocate it to Aus for track only days.

Oh, and in my opinion a 170k ugly as sin common door is absurd. As has been suggested, a C63 would be the a no brainer, and offer way more of everything for your dollar.

philstoj · 21-06-2008, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miller

For that sort of money you can buy a second hand Ferrari F355 GTS...I know which I'd be buying

I love to see you drive it everyday and maintain it, services etc, spares and insurance!!

XplosiveR6 · 21-06-2008, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philstoj

I love to see you drive it everyday and maintain it, services etc, spares and insurance!!

well if you can afford $150,000 on a car, i don't think they will be too much trouble to afford, plus i the maintenance on the 427 will be a bit more evolved then your standard V6 hack.

dallasv8 · 22-06-2008, 12:52 AM

i bet they go like the clappers and all that...but im pretty sure if i see one while under the influence i will probably have the urge to have some holden showers haha

but geez, thats a bloody dear commode

**CAT600** · 22-06-2008, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summoner

why everyone crying over the price? Fact is if ford released a GT-HO at that price point and it actually had performance to match ford nuts would be falling over themselves to buy it if they could afford it.

While I agree with the basic principal of what you are saying, I would also expect the GTHO, at that price, to carry more "Heritage" features:

Functional bodykit
Heritage Striping (with the Super-roo)
Functional air intake
Retro styled wheels (20" Globes?)
An engine unlike any we currently have (like the Clevo was to the PHII/III) perhaps a few prototype 777's :

Either that or just don't build a GTHO, just a GT-P that has the on road muscle to match the W427, but at a realistic price. I guess what I am saying is that IF IT IS EXECUTED PROPERLY, THE GTHO BADGE HAS THE RIGHT TO COMMAND A PRICE PREMIUM. The W427 moniker has not, and although the GTS name may have had that right, it has been prostituted over the years to the point where it has the same engine, brakes and suspension as the most basic HSV product. HSV even tried a GTS-R in 1997, but that was just a sticker job. When you look at it, for all criticism of FPV we dish out, they have never degraded a badge to the same level that our opposition have.

Overall, I like the concept of the W427, but the problem I have with it is that it is marketed as a $110,000 car, but priced $50,000 above that. Just a cash grab.

HSV's marketing strategy seems to work with it's consumers:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Based on HSV's past history, give it 5 years and Clubsports will probably be making that much power, and the 427 will be worth less than a quarter of its selling price ala GTS 300.

Treat 'em mean, keep 'em keen.

Daniel

da_ilks · 23-06-2008, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

No it won't, they only want to build small numbers. Doesn't matter how many potential orders they get if they can't build anymore than 200 over the next 2 years. Thats small potatoes.

It's meant to be an exclusive model anyway, a small batch of 200 will keep them exclusive and re-sale prices high. I think some are suggesting they'd struggle to sell 200....