Why do Police enforce road rules?

[barra265t]

Just had a brainwave and wondered why do police traditionally enforce road rules when:
- parking inspectors enforce parking rules (not the role of the police)
- private companies are employed to run mobile speed cameras (supposedly not the role of the police?)

Don't the police have enough on their hands already, without needing the added burden of sitting idle beside highways checking speed, for example. Also, the erosion of respect for police arising from them carrying out these duties, when they could better spend this time fighting violent crime, drugs, terrorism, etc., Certainly this can't be good?

So, with some states like Victoria having the state road authority patrol cars (don't vicroads have fully marked vicroads patrol cars these days?), why can't the responsibility of patrolling the rules be carried out by these folk instead and police scrap the Traffic Management Units and replace them with different Task Forces?

[Peuty]

Because it would just be the Police by another name?

Unless you are suggesting that it should be privatised - then we'd all be up the creek.

[barra265t]

Are state road authorities private companies or state-owned companies?
Even if they were just Police by another name, I still think that this would be a good thing as all the current legislation doesnt put the Police in the good books of many of the younger generation or car enthusiast. Police are a valuable part of society and erosion of respect for them in any form is certainly very dangerous. Actual crime fighting should be under the honorable role of 'Police', but other duties such as enforcing road rules (isn't this part of maintaining the road network, hence responsibilty of state road authority?) should come under a different banner even if enforced by the same organisation.

[barra265t]

If I recall correctly, didn't the NSW police just over a year ago refuse to hand out tickets to motorists for minor offences such as speeding, as part of strike action regarding their pay? Shows how those police really felt about that aspect of their job and its importance in the overall scheme of things (putting $$ in the state's coffers)?

[TURBOTAXI]

RTA actually pays for allot of the HWP enforcement done by Police.

[ford man xf]

This year Vicroads officers were given special powers to issue infringement notices for anything on the roads during a a major blitz, but I always thought they had these powers to issue infringement notices to any vehicle?

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by ford man xf

This year Vicroads officers were given special powers to issue infringement notices for anything on the roads during a a major blitz, but I always thought they had these powers to issue infringement notices to any vehicle?

Technically they have, however, they only tend to use these powers to enforce rules with tucks and to a lesser degree, taxis.

It was more of a PR stunt to let the average Joe know that they can get you for anything that the police can and that you must pull over when you see the pretty pink lights in the mirror.

It was also to help with a shortfall of police because of the state government not funding adequate police numbers.

Originally Posted by barra265t

Don't the police have enough on their hands already, without needing the added burden of sitting idle beside highways checking speed, for example. Also, the erosion of respect for police arising from them carrying out these duties, when they could better spend this time fighting violent crime, drugs, terrorism, etc., Certainly this can't be good?

Originally Posted by Peuty

Because it would just be the Police by another name?

But unlike police, they are public servants and employees of private companies. I would much rather have my tickets written out by a sworn member rather than some “would be if they could be” security guard.

Personally, I’d rather see the police doing more, not less. Get rid of all those council by law mongs, private speed camera operators and Gestapo private parking “officers”.

[saam]

whenever the money pool is low, thats when you get to see police waiting along the side of the road......

[mrbaxr6t]

Originally Posted by saam

whenever the money pool is low, thats when you get to see police waiting along the side of the road......

this cracked me up! don't stop there

whenever there is donuts marked down at the shop thats when you see the police

etcettera

[ford man xf]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

Technically they have, however, they only tend to use these powers to enforce rules with tucks and to a lesser degree, taxis.

It was more of a PR stunt to let the average Joe know that they can get you for anything that the police can and that you must pull over when you see the pretty pink lights in the mirror.

It was also to help with a shortfall of police because of the state government not funding adequate police numbers.


But unlike police, they are public servants and employees of private companies. I would much rather have my tickets written out by a sworn member rather that some “would be if they could be” security guard.

Thats what I thought as well, so in reality they never got special powers, so how do they deal with drunk drivers or agressive poeple they pull over, do they carry firearms or protective/defensive equipment? And are they trained for such encounters?

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by ford man xf

Thats what I thought as well, so in reality they never got special powers, so how do they deal with drunk drivers or agressive poeple they pull over, do they carry firearms or protective/defensive equipment? And are they trained for such encounters?

This was a big issue at the time and to my understanding, has not yet been resolved. When VicRoads pull over a truck in the middle of nowhere in the dark of night, they know that they generally, will be OK. However, if they pulled over a car with four rather large people carrying weapons, the outcome may be very different.

I think that it’s a marvellous idea, because some of those power hungry VicRoads Gestapo’s might get what’s coming to them. They’ll learn very quickly that they can’t treat the general public like the way they treat truck drivers.


P.S. I love VicRoads.

[Jim Goose]

Er they enforce the law because thats what they do..... They are responsible for enforcing it and also most council bylaws.

Parking fines are a council bylaw.. hence council officers can issue those tickets.

From the QLD RTA...

Part 2 Authorised officers and
accredited persons
20 Appointment of authorised officers
(1) Every police officer is an authorised officer.
(2) The chief executive may appoint any of the following persons
to be an authorised officer—
(a) officers and employees of the public service;
(b) other persons prescribed under a regulation.

A transport officer is therefor an authorised person and can pull you over... hence the cars they drive fitted with sirens and lightbars.

[Jim Goose]

If your a transport business....

from the QLD act...

26A Further power to enter place of business in relation to
heavy vehicle or prescribed dangerous goods vehicle
(1) Without limiting section 26 but subject to section 26B, an
authorised officer may enter a place of business of a
responsible person for a heavy vehicle, or a place of business
of a person involved in the transport of dangerous goods, at
any time during the usual business hours of the business—
(a) without the occupier’s consent or a warrant; and
(b) whether or not the place is actually being used at that
time for carrying on the business;

Enter your place of business....

[ford man xf]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

This was a big issue at the time and to my understanding, has not yet been resolved. When VicRoads pull over a truck in the middle of nowhere in the dark of night, they know that they generally, will be OK. However, if they pulled over a car with four rather large people carrying weapons, the outcome may be very different.

I think that it’s a marvellous idea, because some of those power hungry VicRoads Gestapo’s might get what’s coming to them. They’ll learn very quickly that they can’t treat the general public like the way they treat truck drivers.


P.S. I love VicRoads.

Hahaha! Its true what you say though, I speak to a lot of truck drivers at work and they can't stand VicRoads officers, I know they are only doing there jobs enforcing laws that the government policy makers come up with, but some of the stories you hear from the truck drivers amazes me, but there is always two sides to a story I guess.

[jaydee]

Are you serious with this question?

Police have the authority to exceed the speed limit to catch speeders, are trained to drive in pursuits and have the power of arrest.
And are you saying we should give all these powers to some private security type company.

And if the Police hand out tickets or catch morons doing 200km/h and take them off the road and impound their car you say is eroding their respect and they should be out catching real criminals.

I dont think the Police are out there to make friends, they get enough repeat customers without having to worry about if theyve upset someones day because they got a ticket for not having their kid in a seat belt or speeding through a school zone.

Thats why they have detectives to do murders, rapes, burglaries etc.
I bet my last dollar that if a cop car is on the side of the road doing radar and a stolen car that just did an armed robbery flies past he will take of after it, or if a radio call comes in for someone being assaulted down the road they will go and help out.

But keep the doughnut jokes coming, they are really original.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by ford man xf

Hahaha! Its true what you say though, I speak to a lot of truck drivers at work and they can't stand VicRoads officers, I know they are only doing there jobs enforcing laws that the government policy makers come up with, but some of the stories you hear from the truck drivers amazes me, but there is always two sides to a story I guess.

With some people, there’ no pleasing them. I’ve given up interstate driving because of the governments stupid fatigue rules that were put in place two years ago, so now I generally do local or the odd country trip.

There’s enforcement, and there’s enforcement. When a VicRoads mong goes back 60 pages in your logbook and finds that you misspelt Coonabarabran or didn't sign a page, then writes you up for it, it’s a little hard to have sympathy for them. There are some things that are perfectly legal in NSW and QLD yet are illegal in Vic and more often than not, the first time you find out about it is when they knock you off. We supposedly have a national set of rules that enforce driving hours, yet every state has their own interpretation of them, the system is a complete joke.

Like I said in a previous post. I would rather deal with police. Sometimes when they pull you over, it’s just for a licence and rego check, and she’s all good. When VicRoads pull you over, you tend not to walk away empty handed even though in the past, I have.

[GORDZ]

I just want to experience the policing that our fathers talk about. Plod saw you doing something stupid, he'd beat the crap out of you and send you home to your father for another **** whooping. I really thank that would be more effective than some points and a fine. Certainly doesn't make me respect todays police anyway.

PS: I haven't lost a single point since I got my full licence, so don't go thinking i'm 'sore'. Just saying.

[Bobman]

^ agreed. The other thing is back in the old days there was more focus on teaching you a lesson if you had done something wrong. The focus these days is $$$.

There are still a few decent HWP officers amongst the ranks that really care about teaching people that what they were doing was wrong and to avoid it in the future, but a lot of those guys are retiring now - replaced by young guys with a ship on their shoulder.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by GORDZ

I just want to experience the policing that our fathers talk about. Plod saw you doing something stupid, he'd beat the crap out of you and send you home to your father for another **** whooping. I really thank that would be more effective than some points and a fine. Certainly doesn't make me respect todays police anyway.

Here’s an example of some “old fashioned” policing and the little sook goes and cries to the media.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/world/805...er-fake-arrest

The boy says he was terrified during the ordeal inside his San Jose home — and now wants the veteran motorcycle policeman to feel the same fear, local newspaper the Mercury News reports.

The little tu#d needs to be bashed within an inch of his life.

[GORDZ]

so thats an 'agreed' right? The sooner we get into our old practices, the more we can hope to delay becoming american and sueing everyone for every little thing.

[Jim Goose]

Unfortunately a cop cant get "involved" in his own issues as a policeman...
If he had turned up in civillian clothes no dramas.... or got another cop to do it.
In reality if he arrested the kid it would get thrown out of court as the matter is about his own daughter.

I can understand the reasons why he did it... but yes its a sad world we live in.

[Auturbo6]

I think the subject of police no longer patroling the nations roads, but allowing private companies to carry out these tasks, is fraut with issues. Lets disreguard speeding etc, and think outside the square a little. One would be suprised to learn that a lot of crime fighting is actually carried out wilst a vehicle is pulled over. Such as:

Drugs, finding illicit substances on person or in vehicle. Drug dealing, finding large quantities on person or hidden in vehicle, utensils etc.

Robbery, finding stolen goods in vehicles,

Warrant arrests, self expanatory, be it driver or passengers.

Etc. These and many more reasons, are why i hope privatising road rule enforcement does not ever eventuate. Keep pulling everyone over police, and keep society manageable.

[geckoGT]

The easy answer is the job of the police is to enforce law and order, in other words to apply the elements of commonwealth and state legislation and ensure public compliance, which is what our road laws are. Simply put it is their job.

[|||]

the short answer is people are scared of the police. i'm sure plenty of you have been through an EPA defect station set up near a car show. the police pull you in then hand you over to the EPA. personally i think the EPA should do this type of work themselves but they use the cops to keep people in line while they dish out the fines.

[WMD351]

It all goes back to Thursdays thread about police harassment, it's so they can "hassle" everybody.

[seduced_xr]

more money is made hassling motorists 10kmh over, saving someone from beind stabbed to death costs money.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by barra265t

Just had a brainwave and wondered why do police traditionally enforce road rules when:
- parking inspectors enforce parking rules (not the role of the police)
- private companies are employed to run mobile speed cameras (supposedly not the role of the police?)

Don't the police have enough on their hands already, without needing the added burden of sitting idle beside highways checking speed, for example. Also, the erosion of respect for police arising from them carrying out these duties, when they could better spend this time fighting violent crime, drugs, terrorism, etc., Certainly this can't be good?

So, with some states like Victoria having the state road authority patrol cars (don't vicroads have fully marked vicroads patrol cars these days?), why can't the responsibility of patrolling the rules be carried out by these folk instead and police scrap the Traffic Management Units and replace them with different Task Forces?

There's more to being a traffic cop then issuing fines. The two examples given by you are rubbish excuses by councils and state governments to fill their coffers.

[Keepleft]

Originally Posted by TURBOTAXI

RTA actually pays for allot of the HWP enforcement done by Police.

Yes, in NSW as targetted speed enforcement programs.

Get my way and a freed-up NSW Highway Patrol will get their funding from the police budget once again. RTA face overhaul.

This means actioning the NSW Auditor, the Attorney General Dept and NSW Treasury. These, over the years have effectively decided RTA monetary direction and budget, hence its "activites" in policing.

RTA performance based outcome working contracts need scrutiny.

I feel very sorry for the NSW Libs - the bloody mess they inherit. They also need to take a step back and reclaim State sovereignity over roads, licensing and transport matters. Another issue.

[onfire]

Originally Posted by Peuty

Because it would just be the Police by another name?

Unless you are suggesting that it should be privatised - then we'd all be up the creek.

You'd think it already was.

[Fled74]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

Get rid of all those council bylaw mongs, private speed camera operators and Gestapo private parking “officers”.

Originally Posted by Full Noise

When a VicRoads mong

Mate, I fully understand where you're coming from, but please keep in mind that some of us here have relatives with Down Syndrome, and the term "mong" (mongoloid) is grossly inappropriate. Just thought you'd like to know.