Limp Home Mode

GK · 23-05-2007, 07:16 PM

About 30 mins ago, whilst travelling home, the auto went into Limp Home Mode. It stayed in third but would go into 1st or 2nd if I pulled it into that gear. I decided to leave it in drive though.

What are some of the reasons that this mode activates? I'll take the car to Fluidrive in the morning and see what gives.

Another question. Since I upgraded to a S1 XR dash, there is no icon for the auto econ mode. Am I right in assuming that the transmission still be able to switch between these modes, even though it won't be displayed on the dash?

GK

Riksta · 23-05-2007, 07:24 PM

I believe they're listed in the car's manual if you've still got one, I remember reading through it and reading about it, off the top of my head the main one I remember was overheating or loss of radiator fluid.

If nobody on here can list them all, I'll be happy to grab the manual out my car and write them up for you, will kill a bit of time for me

**Mechan1k** · 23-05-2007, 07:34 PM

Seeing as the XR used adaptive shift .... I don't think it showed ECON on the dash at all .... but I am pretty sure it still can be used though.

LHM can be caused by a number of things ... failed sensors ... overheating ... low fluid ... Solenoid failure .... dirty connectors to the transmission. Just to name a few.

GK · 23-05-2007, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riksta

I believe they're listed in the car's manual if you've still got one, I remember reading through it and reading about it, off the top of my head the main one I remember was overheating or loss of radiator fluid.

If nobody on here can list them all, I'll be happy to grab the manual out my car and write them up for you, will kill a bit of time for me

I have a manual, I guess I was just being a little lazy! I appreciate your offer though.

Cheers,

GK

GK · 23-05-2007, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

LHM can be caused by a number of things ... failed sensors ... overheating ... low fluid ... Solenoid failure .... dirty connectors to the transmission. Just to name a few.

The transmission may have overheted but not the engine. The low coolant sensor didn't activate, nor did the temp coolant light. At the mo, the temp gauge isn't operational due to a glitch in the XR cluster install. I'm still waiting on some help to get to the bottom of that one.

I just read in the book as well as the possible cause listed my mechanik, it could also be a crook battery. I'm checking that one now.

What should the voltmeter say? Which setting do I switch it to?

GK

GK · 23-05-2007, 08:17 PM

Well the voltmeter tells me that the battery has 12 volts with everything off and 13.9 with the car going. The voltmeter on the Tickford dash says 14. So I don't think that could be it.

I guess it's off to fluidrive in the morning. Hope it's nothing expensive! LOL! I'll keep you posted.

Thanks for your posts fellas!

GK

FGII-XR6 · 23-05-2007, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

Seeing as the XR used adaptive shift .... I don't think it showed ECON on the dash at all .... but I am pretty sure it still can be used though.

LHM can be caused by a number of things ... failed sensors ... overheating ... low fluid ... Solenoid failure .... dirty connectors to the transmission. Just to name a few.

the econ light is still in use with adaptive shift it indicates mode a change by flashing the apropriate number of times for each mode change. and indicates what mode you are in at start up by staying on if you have selected econ flashing 3 times at startup if in full power mode or staying off in adaptive mode

FGII-XR6 · 23-05-2007, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GK

The transmission may have overheted but not the engine. The low coolant sensor didn't activate, nor did the temp coolant light. At the mo, the temp gauge isn't operational due to a glitch in the XR cluster install. I'm still waiting on some help to get to the bottom of that one.

I just read in the book as well as the possible cause listed my mechanik, it could also be a crook battery. I'm checking that one now.

What should the voltmeter say? Which setting do I switch it to?

GK

the cluster change will not impact on the operation of the temp gague the only wires that are different are the ABS warning the right indicator and cluster illumination so if your temp gague is not working there may be an issue with the sender wire you may even have the gague and coolant temp sensor switched so check out your wiring

peterban · 23-05-2007, 10:20 PM

Hi George.
For your temp guage problem did you short out the sender wire and see if the guage reads hot.

The limp home mode can also be caused by having no speed signal to speedo.
It may well have something to do with changing your cluster over.
You could try putting the old cluster back in and see if that fixes all your problems
( with the car that is )
Good luck

GK · 23-05-2007, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterban

Hi George.
For your temp guage problem did you short out the sender wire and see if the guage reads hot.

The limp home mode can also be caused by having no speed signal to speedo.
It may well have something to do with changing your cluster over.
You could try putting the old cluster back in and see if that fixes all your problems
( with the car that is )
Good luck

How do I short out the sender wire Peter? Please explain.

The speedo is working fine.

GK

JC · 23-05-2007, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GK

How do I short out the sender wire Peter? Please explain.

The speedo is working fine.

GK

Short out usually means connect to earth, so I assume that's what PB means here - I hope!

peterban · 23-05-2007, 11:25 PM

Yep, temp guage works on grounding to earth.
Find temp sender and disconnect the one wire that is plugged into it.
Touch a wire that is connected to earth ( negative on battery is easy ) to the wire connection you have just removed from the sender. If circuit is OK the guage ( with ignition lights on ) should move to hot.

It is puzzling why the auto would all of a sudden go into limp home mode.
I guess we will find out tomorrow

GK · 24-05-2007, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterban

Yep, temp guage works on grounding to earth.
Find temp sender and disconnect the one wire that is plugged into it.
Touch a wire that is connected to earth ( negative on battery is easy ) to the wire connection you have just removed from the sender. If circuit is OK the guage ( with ignition lights on ) should move to hot.

It is puzzling why the auto would all of a sudden go into limp home mode.
I guess we will find out tomorrow

I've pulled the connector on the temp gauge sender before and it's got two little slots (where the corresponding prongs on the actual sender unit go into). Could I just put a wire in one of those and connect it to the negative terminal. A long bit of wire'd do the trick right?

Peter, what would the problem be if the gauge doesn't move? A dodgy sender? It was working before I swapped clusters. Honest! LOL!

And to think that before these problems, my auto was working a treat. It was the SR auto that was giving me trouble. Now it appears I have 2 not working exactly as they should. Darn cars! LOL!

GK

FGII-XR6 · 24-05-2007, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GK

I've pulled the connector on the temp gauge sender before and it's got two little slots (where the corresponding prongs on the actual sender unit go into). Could I just put a wire in one of those and connect it to the negative terminal. A long bit of wire'd do the trick right?

Peter, what would the problem be if the gauge doesn't move? A dodgy sender? It was working before I swapped clusters. Honest! LOL!

And to think that before these problems, my auto was working a treat. It was the SR auto that was giving me trouble. Now it appears I have 2 not working exactly as they should. Darn cars! LOL!

GK

that is your coolant temp sensor not the gague wire the gague sender has only 1 wire

GK · 24-05-2007, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by au3xr6

that is your coolant temp sensor not the gague wire the gague sender has only 1 wire

Now I'm confused! Where is the sender you guys are talking about?

After looking at the Max Ellery manual, it appears to me that they are the same thing. It's called the Coolant temperature Sender as well as the Temperature Sensor.

BTW, you can all clearly see that electronics are purely and simply not my thing! I am trying to learn though, hard as it is! LOL!

GK

FGII-XR6 · 24-05-2007, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GK

Now I'm confused! Where is the sender you guys are talking about?

After looking at the Max Ellery manual, it appears to me that they are the same thing. It's called the Coolant temperature Sender as well as the Temperature Sensor.

GK

sorry i stand corrected what i said before applied up to the end of the Eseries this is from the AU workshop manual remove the sensor with 2 wires (do not earth this sensor) that you have already found (sorry for the missinformation)stand in a container of water with a thermometer and heat measuring resistance at the following points
@ 20 degrees c 37Kohms
@ 30 degrees c 24Kohms
@ 40 degrees c 16Kohms
@ 60 degrees c 7.6Kohms
@ 80 degrees c 3.8Kohms
@ 100 degrees c 2.1Kohms
also with ignition on and sensor removed measure voltage accross the 2 wires it should be 4.5 to 5 Volts
good luck as your gague is not working and you are in limp mode i'd say this is your problem

GK · 24-05-2007, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by au3xr6

sorry i stand corrected what i said before applied up to the end of the Eseries this is from the AU workshop manual remove the sensor with 2 wires (do not earth this sensor) that you have already found (sorry for the missinformation)stand in a container of water with a thermometer and heat measuring resistance at the following points
@ 20 degrees c 37Kohms
@ 30 degrees c 24Kohms
@ 40 degrees c 16Kohms
@ 60 degrees c 7.6Kohms
@ 80 degrees c 3.8Kohms
@ 100 degrees c 2.1Kohms

good luck

That's a heck of a test procedure! LOL! I'd rather do the earth test! LOL!

I understand that I need to test myself, or have someone test the sender. But why would the sender die between the cluster changeover? It doesn't make sense.

GK

peterban · 24-05-2007, 12:52 AM

Hi George.
Sorry I was under the impression it was only one wire.

Try what is suggested above.

It does sound as if the cluster is somehow not wired correctly.
When you changed the cluster did it just plug straight in or did you change some of the wires?

I would be tempted to plug the old cluster back in and see if the temp guage works again. If it does then it is obviously the XR cluster.

The auto is strange, if the cluster was affecting the auto it would have started playing up straight away.

It could be that the computer thinks the engine is overheating as it is not sensing the temp and has put the auto into limp home mode.
The only thing with this theory is that the AU would start to shut down cylinders when it thinks it is overheating unless you are running on gas

FGII-XR6 · 24-05-2007, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterban

Hi George.
Sorry I was under the impression it was only one wire.

Try what is suggested above.

It does sound as if the cluster is somehow not wired correctly.
When you changed the cluster did it just plug straight in or did you change some of the wires?

I would be tempted to plug the old cluster back in and see if the temp guage works again. If it does then it is obviously the XR cluster.

The auto is strange, if the cluster was affecting the auto it would have started playing up straight away.

It could be that the computer thinks the engine is overheating as it is not sensing the temp and has put the auto into limp home mode.
The only thing with this theory is that the AU would start to shut down cylinders when it thinks it is overheating unless you are running on gas

if you do this you risk damaging the ECU connect a resistor around 2.1K ohms and this should give you a hot reading on the gague if this works it is the sensor and you just need to replace it but do not just short it out if the sensor was going high (reading zero temp) the tranny would have worked but the engine would have been rich as the sensor got worse it may have gone open circuit causing limp mode

GK · 24-05-2007, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterban

Hi George.
Sorry I was under the impression it was only one wire.

If it has 2 wires just jumper them from one to the other ( i.e. just a small wire from one side of the plug to the other ) and see if the guage goes to hot.
If that doesn't work try to earth one side of the plug at a time and check the guage each time.
If it does it is the sender. If it doesn't it will be the wireing.

It does sound as if the cluster is somehow not wired correctly.
When you changed the cluster did it just plug straight in or did you change some of the wires?

I would be tempted to plug the old cluster back in and see if the temp guage works again. If it does then it is obviously the XR cluster.

The auto is strange, if the cluster was affecting the auto it would have started playing up straight away.

It could be that the computer thinks the engine is overheating as it is not sensing the temp and has put the auto into limp home mode.
The only thing with this theory is that the AU would start to shut down cylinders when it thinks it is overheating unless you are running on gas

Car's running on gas. Failsafe cooling won't work. I did run it to work yesterday on petrol though (42 km's) and no limp home mode.

It's done 400 kays since I changed the cluster and no limp home mode until today. If it was overheating, wouldn't the red thermometer on the cluster light up as well?

Plugging in the old cluster will take a bit of rewiring, as 4 wires needed to be cut. It'd be a bit of a job hooking them back up! I'm beginning to think that the cluster upgrade was a dodgy idea! LOL!

If I just decided that after some working on it that it would just be better to go back to the old faithful way it was, would the low series cluster oil pressue warning light work with the pressure sender, or would I have to change it back to the simple switch?

A appreciate the help guys.

I will test the coolant wiring and sender in the morning though. Thanks for all the help guys.

GK

FGII-XR6 · 24-05-2007, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GK

Car's running on gas. Failsafe cooling won't work. I did run it to work yesterday on petrol though (42 km's) and no limp home mode.

It's done 400 kays since I changed the cluster and no limp home mode until today. If it was overheating, wouldn't the red thermometer on the cluster light up as well?

Plugging in the old cluster will take a bit of rewiring, as 4 wires needed to be cut. It'd be a bit of a job hooking them back up! I'm beginning to think that the cluster upgrade was a dodgy idea! LOL!

If I just decided that after some working on it that it would just be better to go back to the old faithful way it was, would the low series cluster oil pressue warning light work with the pressure sender, or would I have to change it back to the simple switch?

A appreciate the help guys.

I will test the coolant wiring and sender in the morning though. Thanks for all the help guys.

GK

you would have to change back to a switch i have done a cluster upgrade with no dramas so it is doable you'll get there

peterban · 24-05-2007, 01:11 AM

au3xr6 is correct.
If you do short out the two wires you may damage something. The earth method is only for one wire set up.
The 2K to 3K resistor would be the easiest way to check the guage.
Just bend the resistor tails and insert tails into the plug that you have removed from sensor.

peterban · 24-05-2007, 01:27 AM

Have you driven the car again since it went into limp home mode?
If it only goes into limp home mode after running for awhile would tend to suggest temp related.

GK · 24-05-2007, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterban

au3xr6 is correct.
If you do short out the two wires you may damage something. The earth method is only for one wire set up.
The 2K to 3K resistor would be the easiest way to check the guage.
Just bend the resistor tails and insert tails into the plug that you have removed from sensor.

I don't have any resistors lying around the place. I get what you mean though. Use the resistor to complete the circuit. I guess I could get one from Tandy easy enough.

Thanks for the tip au3xr6, I was just about to use some wire to short the circuit, but thought I should check the this thread first. Cheers!

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterban

Have you driven the car again since it went into limp home mode?
If it only goes into limp home mode after running for awhile would tend to suggest temp related.

I haven't driven the car as yet, but will do so in a minute. It's 6:30am so if it's temp related, it shouldn't still be in LHM. The engine and transmission should be icy cold!

I'll post back in a few minutes after a short spin.

In any case, the car will be at the auto joint at 8am.

GK

GK · 24-05-2007, 08:16 AM

Got back from a spin, car wasn't in LHM.

I'll take it to the auto joint and have them do a scan of the codes, take it for a test drive etc and then get them to check and change the fluid and filter etc.

I'll then drive it to work and see what comes of it. I'll also pop past Tandy and ask for a 2K to 3K resistor.

GK

LOWAU · 24-05-2007, 10:32 AM

GK- my auto goes into LHM every now and then when I am running on LPG. It only happens when I start the car on LPG and go to take off straight away, after a minute its ok and goes back to normal.

Does it happen to you on Petrol? For mine I think its the ford ECU and the gas ECU taking a min to talk to each other, but i',m not 100%.

Casper · 24-05-2007, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by au3xr6

the econ light is still in use with adaptive shift it indicates mode a change by flashing the apropriate number of times for each mode change. and indicates what mode you are in at start up by staying on if you have selected econ flashing 3 times at startup if in full power mode or staying off in adaptive mode

That only applies to AU2/3 XR's. Tha AU1 XR dash has no econ light and does not show what mode you are in.

GK · 24-05-2007, 11:51 AM

Hi fellow AUvians,

Had to leave the car at the auto trans joint.

He did hook up the computer though and these are 2 codes that came up.

PO1117
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor (ECT) circuit low input

PO1118
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor (ECT) circuit high input

I guess this is the origin of the temp gauge not working! I hope it's just a dodgy sender or something.

Was the low and high series sender for coolant temp the same right across the range. My head says yes, but you never know sometimes!

Whilst it's there, he's doing the auto service and possibly a full flush. He'll call me when he sees the colour of the fluid! Should be ok, it's only done 30,000 or so IIRC.

The car did go into LHM whilst on gas, it's never done it before. The system is factory gas.

In any case, it should be all (temp gauge too hopefully) sorted by today's end.

I did speak to Dino again about the SR autos problems. It actually sounds like a combo of things, solenoids, valve body and most likely converter also. He didn't think it was the inhibitor but told me that if the car is in 1st (manually selected) and it still changes gears, the inhibitor is stuffed.

The cost of a fully recoed tranny with 2,200 stallie instead of the stock 1,800ish item is $1950 installed. With the stock stallie, the price would be $1,650. He didn't mention the need for a cooler at all.

So the AU dramas for GK continue! LOL!

FGII-XR6 · 24-05-2007, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casper

That only applies to AU2/3 XR's. Tha AU1 XR dash has no econ light and does not show what mode you are in.

thanks for the info casper didn't know about the S1 another bit of info filed away

ClassicAU · 24-05-2007, 04:34 PM

You been N-bashing the thing George!! :P Its stories like these that have convinced me to do the manual conversion. You can get it done for an extra $500 or so on top of the price of a reco. Just something to think about!

Evan