Let's jump on trucks yet again

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by vztrt

So how hoes that stop congestion in the cities??

Can only comment on Melb, we could have rail freight distributed from several areas, the docks, Dandenong, etc , rather than having trucks choking the road from the outer North suburbs such as craigeburn on the Hume all the way through to Berwick on the princess.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Can only comment on Melb, we could have rail freight distributed from several areas, the docks, Dandenong, etc , rather than having trucks choking the road from the outer North suburbs such as craigeburn on the Hume all the way through to Berwick on the princess.

Yeah its the trucks causing the congestion

[Franco Cozzo]

Makes me wonder if the boys working at Toyota, Mazda and Honda would have seen the accident if they where out the back, in the carparks they back onto the Tulla basically.

[deesun]

Won't it again be the truck at fault? When a pedestrian is involved the vehicle/driver is usually charged.

[Mechan1k]

Originally Posted by deesun

Won't it again be the truck at fault? When a pedestrian is involved the vehicle/driver is usually charged.

It's always the truck drivers' fault ... even when it's not ... they still get blamed.

[SEZ213]

Originally Posted by deesun

Won't it again be the truck at fault? When a pedestrian is involved the vehicle/driver is usually charged.

I guess it all depends on what the definition of the law is in this instance, she was illegally on the freeway - if she 'just stepped out', I would imagine it would be pretty hard to charge him with anything.

The odd thing is all those jumping on the bandwagon suggesting that trucks should be banned from right hand lanes, etc. may not be aware that of the accidents that occurred between trucks and cars last year, 65% of those accidents; were NOT the truck drivers fault.

People are way too complacent on the road, and that is a certainty...

[snappy]

Originally Posted by mr smith

Governments should be encouraging freight onto rail and off the roads.

Western ring road is full of trucks being driven by lunatics.

Trucks are a common topic at work and 99.99% of people hate them.

I agree .
There is far to many trucks on the road and if i had a dollar for everytime i see a truck tailgaiting someone i be a rich man . I somtimes i actually wonder if they teach truckies to tailgate
Yes those drivers are usually sitting in the wrong lane and probly barely doing the limit . But god damn it is so dangerous

[blackf6]

Originally Posted by snappy

I agree .
There is far to many trucks on the road and if i had a dollar for everytime i see a truck tailgaiting someone i be a rich man . I somtimes i actually wonder if they teach truckies to tailgate
Yes those drivers are usually sitting in the wrong lane and probly barely doing the limit . But god damn it is so dangerous

yes it is dangerous, and yes the person that usually gets tailgated does 10 ks under the limit, then when the truck has a safe chance to pass the car speeds up and then slows down again to under the limit oblivious of the truck trying to pass them. i in no way condone tailgating of cars. just my 2 cents i think the roads would be a much safer place if all the national highways were divided instead of traffic heading towards eachother in such close proximity, such as the motorways in cities are. and i think for major haul routes that there should be truck only roads to ease congestion. i must also add if a truck has caught you and is driving rite behind you, it means that you are dawdling and driving under the posted limit. and let me say if i had a 50 tonne vehicle on my back bumper i would either speed up and get away from them or let them pass simple as that.

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by teak81

. i must also add if a truck has caught you and is driving rite behind you, it means that you are dawdling and driving under the posted limit. and let me say if i had a 50 tonne vehicle on my back bumper i would either speed up and get away from them or let them pass simple as that.

Absolutely no justification for the behaviour of the truck driver, last time I checked the road rules there wasnt a rule that says, "if the vehicle in front is doing less than the speed limit, then follow at an unsafe distance until they travel at a speed you want them to".
The behaviour is moronic and criminal.

Also very hard to speed up when there is traffic in front of you and you are blocked out from changing lanes by trucks either side........that's what driving on the Western ring road is like, and a very dangerous road to be on, it is always curving and many trucks dont manage to be able to hold their lanes.

Not all of us imagine things! There are responsible truck drivers out there and there are some cretons, just the same for car drivers. The difference is the creton car drivers aren't in charge of 50 tonnes doing 100km/h.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

For you my good sir, primary school should have been an eye opener.

My dear friend, Sudszy. I don’t know whether to laugh or feel sorry for you. You can’t even get a bloody insult right. If that’s what you remember from your primary school days, perhaps you should go back to primary school and pay a bit more attention this time.

The saying is actually “an empty vessel makes most noise” you dill. You could also use the alternative, an empty vessel makes much noise but you probably needed to go to a private school for that version.

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

There needs to be a mass-cleansing of the gene pool.

This is underway as we speak. Here’s some clown wearing his "really cool" hoodie trying to cross the Western Ring Road at the Keilor Park Dr overpass yesterday just before 4:00 PM. Apparently Charles Darwin already has his name engraved on the trophy. For those on AFF who are unfamiliar with this area. This is one of the busiest freeways in Melbourne and I’m directly underneath an overpass that this fool could easily and safely ride over.

Originally Posted by snappy

There is far to many trucks on the road

Yep, as a truck driver, I’d love to see every single truck in Australia off the road, not just for a day, perhaps for a week or so, just enough to bring the entire country to its knees. Only then some of the fools who write the rules that we live by might just realise how vital the road transport industry is.

Originally Posted by snappy

if i had a dollar for everytime i see a truck tailgaiting someone i be a rich man . I somtimes i actually wonder if they teach truckies to tailgate

Boo hoo. If I had 10 cents for every car driving moron who’s pulled in front of me and jumped on the picks because they’ve nearly missed their turn off or because they’re just plain stupid, I would be even richer than you. Now, would you like me to deliver a king sized box of tissues to your house “by truck” so you can get it out of your system? Also, Just wondering, as you’re from Geelong, did you go to a Geelong Grammar?

Originally Posted by Ben73

When a train breaks down they run trains around it on the other tracks. Sometimes causes delays but not always. Not nessiceraly hours delay either.

No, sometimes days and days and days. When was the last time you drove a train to Perth? Have you ever seen the result of a screw journal seizing on a wagon and ripping up 1200 metres of track before they can get it stopped?

[Mechan1k]

I can't believe people are stupid enough to even put the thought in their head that they want to cross a busy multi-lane highway/tollway/freeway during a peak period. And with an overpass soooo close as well.

Sheer laziness I guess.

Ahhhh ... tailgating ... not really a choice for trucks ... as it looks like tailgating after some girl in a hatchback drops in front of a truck and realises that lane of traffic has stopped (most likely the initial cause of the incident reporting by the OP in the first place).

Have seen it all too often ... as I have to negotiate the M4 in Sydney now on a daily basis .... I used to have to deal with the M2 during early peak .... and that was tame compared to the M4. The amount of people trying to rush through solid traffic is eye-opening ... lane swapping all over the place ... with disregard to gaps as well ... just come over and push in. They don't care.

As I have said before ... I'd hate to drive a truck on Sydney's roads ... I have respect for the poor bastards and what they have to deal with. I actually wouldn't mind sitting in for a day shotgun to actually experience what goes on for the full day. It's good seeing the videos first hand ... but to be there and actually see it would be worthwhile. And something a lot of people need to do as well.

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by 350125GO

Think what they are trying to say is let trains do the bulk long distance work and have main hubs where trucks distrubute from there.

Great except everyone knows that trains are unrealiable at getting freight to the other end, it is slow and the highways between cities is NOT where there is congestion, so it is a stupid irrelevant thought to think that trains are a better option.

Just imagine if they forced all long distance freight onto trains, can you imagine the congestion around the end hubs, my god there would be ques of trucks kimometres long waiting to get loaded and unloaded.

Plus the rail infrastructure is out of date dealing with what it handles now, they have to slow to about 40km/h between Seymour and Wodonga and that is AFTER they repaired/replaced all the lines.

What about getting freight out into rural areas of any State, the Governments have shut down many rail lines and these have been shut down for years and in most cases the lines have been pulled up. What do you think the people who ride their push-bikes on "Rail Trails" ride on?

Trains will NEVER compete with road and people need to stop bringing it up as a relevant argument.

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Can only comment on Melb, we could have rail freight distributed from several areas, the docks, Dandenong, etc , rather than having trucks choking the road from the outer North suburbs such as craigeburn on the Hume all the way through to Berwick on the princess.

My god, I can't believe how niave you are, the bloody passenger trains can't get it right across Melbourne now, there is not enough rail infrastructure there to cope with passenger trains and now YOU want to add freight to the network, get a grip on reality my friend.

I reality if you want to free up the road network during busy times, get people to accept freight between 7.00 pm and 6.00 am when the road network is at it quietest. Now, that is a logical thding to suggest, but suggesting rail, my god I can't stop laughing at the suggestion

[Ducati888]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Can only comment on Melb, we could have rail freight distributed from several areas, the docks, Dandenong, etc , rather than having trucks choking the road from the outer North suburbs such as craigeburn on the Hume all the way through to Berwick on the princess.

What's the "princess"?

[Trevor 57]

That is the 'girl' version of the Princes Highway - LOL


These comments about using rail have really cranked my handle I can tell ya!

I can see the trains loaded with wet concrete delivering it to building sites

I can see tippers carting dirt to the new freeways by rail

I can see Courier TRAMS driving around the CBD delivering packages

I can see Cleanaway trains up the lane-ways and going into the rear of suppermarkets to pick up waste, then delivering it by rail to the garbage tips.

My god, these people who suggest trains are doing my head in.

[SEZ213]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

That is the 'girl' version of the Princes Highway - LOL


These comments about using rail have really cranked my handle I can tell ya!

I can see the trains loaded with wet concrete delivering it to building sites

I can see tippers carting dirt to the new freeways by rail

I can see Courier TRAMS driving around the CBD delivering packages

I can see Cleanaway trains up the lane-ways and going into the rear of suppermarkets to pick up waste, then delivering it by rail to the garbage tips.

My god, these people who suggest trains are doing my head in.

I just got a picture of this in my head...and I can't stop laughing...

I don't mind people being idealists (I'm one myself), but the thing is - you can't and I repeat CAN'T just take one segment into consideration, you have to take the whole picture. If you don't, it doesn't work, and if you try to make it work - you end up with the above as Trev has said.

Problem solving skills seem to have fallen by the wayside for the dream of utopia...it seems you can just say something and expect the rhetoric to lead the way. It doesn't, people actually have brains (at least I like to think they do).

I've said it once and I'll say it again - efficiency and cost effectives are not one and the same thing...

[Trevor 57]

Move freight around cities at night - now there is a logical suggestion AND one suggested and supported by Government.

They are complaining as their 'resources', namely roads are being under-utilised for about 10 hours per day.

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

Plus the rail infrastructure is out of date dealing with what it handles now, they have to slow to about 40km/h between Seymour and Wodonga and that is AFTER they repaired/replaced all the lines.

What about getting freight out into rural areas of any State, the Governments have shut down many rail lines and these have been shut down for years and in most cases the lines have been pulled up. What do you think the people who ride their push-bikes on "Rail Trails" ride on?

Trains will NEVER compete with road and people need to stop bringing it up as a relevant argument.

Did I argue that the primary reason for getting trucks off highways was for relieving congestions on roads such as the Hume?

Nor have I argued that the present infrastructure is capable of doing this today.

......but you build yourself a big strawman anyway.


Of course there are people in the road transport industry that want business as usual approach , but I was taking a peek into what we need to do in the future if we want to maintain sustainable cities, and transport costs.

[Seduce XR6]

Originally Posted by teak81

yes it is dangerous, and yes the person that usually gets tailgated does 10 ks under the limit, then when the truck has a safe chance to pass the car speeds up and then slows down again to under the limit oblivious of the truck trying to pass them. i in no way condone tailgating of cars. just my 2 cents i think the roads would be a much safer place if all the national highways were divided instead of traffic heading towards eachother in such close proximity, such as the motorways in cities are. and i think for major haul routes that there should be truck only roads to ease congestion. i must also add if a truck has caught you and is driving rite behind you, it means that you are dawdling and driving under the posted limit. and let me say if i had a 50 tonne vehicle on my back bumper i would either speed up and get away from them or let them pass simple as that.

I am tailgated by large trucks every time I venture onto the pacific Hwy & I am not a slow driver, I set my cruise at 102 kmh which means I am actually on level ground doing 101 kmh as I have checked my speedo accuracy with a few GPS devices & I am only 1 k out from what it reads.

So in a 100 kmh zone with me sitting on 101 kmh why am I tailgated by large trucks????

And when some of them do get past me in overtaking lanes they only slow to like 60 up hills not long after passing me so what is the point as if is an overtaking lane I simply pass them again as my cruise is still set at 102 or if no overtaking lane I have to slow to 60 behind them & be held up.

The only time I am slower than just over the given limit is when cars ahead of me are as I cant drive through them nor do I tailgate the car in front of me as is not his fault the cars ahead of him are slow.

Yes I do have cars tailgating me also when I am sitting just above the speed limit & while that is also annoying it is not as upsetting because a huge truck inches of your bumper is rather scary moreso than another car, but yield I will not as in speeding up to 110 or 115 in a 100 zone etc as I have my rights just as anybody else & it is wrong to expect me to do 10 or 15 k's over the speed limit just because a truck driver or car driver for that matter is in a hurry.

Often if a truck passes you & manages to get ahead out of view you will meet him at the first set of lights in the next town anyway so again why the tailgating & passing of vehicles that are going fast enough?

Now I don't hate truck drivers I just hate the behavior of many of them on the roads.

I spent 15 years working in businesses that involved me seeing semi drivers every day & unloading there trucks, helping them roll up there tarps & even getting them a coffee here & there & most of them were nice blokes who you could share a joke or 2 with & 1 of my best friends drives a petrol tanker up north also & him & I often debate this very subject.

So just be more patient guys & don't tailgate but sit 4 car lengths back & wait for your chance to pass us nasty annoying car drivers

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

My dear friend, Sudszy. I don’t know whether to laugh or feel sorry for you. You can’t even get a bloody insult right. If that’s what you remember from your primary school days, perhaps you should go back to primary school and pay a bit more attention this time.

The saying is actually “an empty vessel makes most noise” you dill. You could also use the alternative, an empty vessel makes much noise but you probably needed to go to a private school for that version.

indeed there are many versions including the one that is more often used:

"an empty vessel makes the loudest noise" which didnt make it to your primary school either?,

given your propensity for "low brow" tactics such hurling insults to try make a point, "full noise" does seem an apt name for yourself and an appropriate alternative for the expression.

[SEZ213]

There really should be an aptitude test for this forum...

Originally Posted by sudszy

indeed there are many versions including the one that is more often used:

"an empty vessel makes the loudest noise" which didnt make it to your primary school either?,

given your propensity for "low brow" tactics such hurling insults to try make a point, "full noise" does seem an apt name for yourself and an appropriate alternative for the expression.

If you're going to try and argue a point, or even express your opinion...you will need to do the following:

1. THINK.
2. THINK MORE.
3. AND THEN THINK SOME MORE.
4. TYPE OUT WHAT YOU THINK.
5. READ IT, TWICE.
6. POST.

It's really easy to shoot off at the hip, when you don't really know the facts.

Sudzy, seriously, you're arguing with people who do this for a living. Do you understand the concept that there are people out there who know a little more about the industry than you? You might have these fantastic ideas, but you only ever seem to focus on one part, come on - it's not black and white, not by any stretch of the imagination.

Or do you think it's okay to just get up on that high horse and denounce everyone else just because 'YOU'RE ALWAYS RIGHT', and you need to be heard?

Were you not paid enough attention as a child or something?

Seriously, this is getting tiresome. People go into threads to read things that interest them, not to read your rhetoric.

And for the record...there was no 'low brow' in there. The only 'low brow' was your response.

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Nor have I argued that the present infrastructure is capable of doing this today.

You are missing the positive response I gave about accepting deliveries etc at "off-peak" times, did you miss that point for a reason?

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by Seduce XR6

I am tailgated by large trucks every time I venture onto the pacific Hwy & I am not a slow driver, I set my cruise at 102 kmh which means I am actually on level ground doing 101 kmh as I have checked my speedo accuracy with a few GPS devices & I am only 1 k out from what it reads.

So in a 100 kmh zone with me sitting on 101 kmh why am I tailgated by large trucks????

And when some of them do get past me in overtaking lanes they only slow to like 60 up hills not long after passing me so what is the point as if is an overtaking lane I simply pass them again as my cruise is still set at 102 or if no overtaking lane I have to slow to 60 behind them & be held up.

The only time I am slower than just over the given limit is when cars ahead of me are as I cant drive through them nor do I tailgate the car in front of me as is not his fault the cars ahead of him are slow.

Yes I do have cars tailgating me also when I am sitting just above the speed limit & while that is also annoying it is not as upsetting because a huge truck inches of your bumper is rather scary moreso than another car, but yield I will not as in speeding up to 110 or 115 in a 100 zone etc as I have my rights just as anybody else & it is wrong to expect me to do 10 or 15 k's over the speed limit just because a truck driver or car driver for that matter is in a hurry.

Often if a truck passes you & manages to get ahead out of view you will meet him at the first set of lights in the next town anyway so again why the tailgating & passing of vehicles that are going fast enough?

Now I don't hate truck drivers I just hate the behavior of many of them on the roads.

I spent 15 years working in businesses that involved me seeing semi drivers every day & unloading there trucks, helping them roll up there tarps & even getting them a coffee here & there & most of them were nice blokes who you could share a joke or 2 with & 1 of my best friends drives a petrol tanker up north also & him & I often debate this very subject.

So just be more patient guys & don't tailgate but sit 4 car lengths back & wait for your chance to pass us nasty annoying car drivers

I can understand your frustrations. Drivers can and do get focused on getting the job done, so to them cars sitting on 100km/h by THEIR speedo is a little frustrating, to consider overtaking a car when you weigh 65 tonne takes som considerable thought and planning. And yes, they would be better off to site behind cars sometimes, I think that is a valid point.

But to clarify a well unknown fact!

When trucks are speed limited, these days it is done via the trucks engine management system (EMS), the speed limit is set in the EMS by the time over distance concept, this is by far the most accurate method, hence the difference between speedo readings and actual speed.

In my experience with GPS system that you buy from Dick Smith / Harvery Norman etc is that they are not always 100% accurate, there are slight variations in them.

So generally speed limited trucks will always appear to be going faster than the posted speed limit.

Notwithstanding this, there are some companies/drivers out there who are able to have someone by-pass the trucks speed-limiter, it isn't that hard, it just requires some-one to modify the nominated speed in the EMS via a laptop computer or like.

On a side note, I always like it when "car drivers" sook about trucks not sitting on speed limits, but many (if not most) car drivers also speed, in case you haven't noticed. In fact there are more car drivers who have speed related accidents than trucks, so why isn't there people screaming from the roof-tops about cars not being speed limited to 110k/h?

[SEZ213]

Originally Posted by sudszy

.....inmates running the asylum logic again, while we are at it, let's ask tobacco executives whether putting plain wrappers on ciggies is a good idea for public health, or get taxi drivers to rewrite the road rules

Tell you what, let's ask the idiots what they want...

Sudzy, What do you want?

Nice to see as usual, you focus on just one part...and leave out the rest because it doesn't suit your logic.

[Trevor 57]

Fantastic

[Seduce XR6]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

I can understand your frustrations. Drivers can and do get focused on getting the job done, so to them cars sitting on 100km/h by THEIR speedo is a little frustrating, to consider overtaking a car when you weigh 65 tonne takes som considerable thought and planning. And yes, they would be better off to site behind cars sometimes, I think that is a valid point.

In my experience with GPS system that you buy from Dick Smith / Harvery Norman etc is that they are not always 100% accurate, there are slight variations in them.[/B]

I have tried a couple & they all show me the same that my speedo is approx 1 km per hour out from my actual speed as in when I my speedo says 100 I am actually doing 99 & I am not sure how satellites can read differently on other devices but you may be right as I have not tried them all.

Originally Posted by Big Trev

Notwithstanding this, there are some companies/drivers out there who are able to have someone by-pass the trucks speed-limiter, it isn't that hard, it just requires some-one to modify the nominated speed in the EMS via a laptop computer or like.[/B]

Damm right I have been passed (slowly) on more than 1 occasion on a flat road when I was sitting on 115

Originally Posted by Big Trev

On a side note, I always like it when "car drivers" sook about trucks not sitting on speed limits, but many (if not most) car drivers also speed, in case you haven't noticed. In fact there are more car drivers who have speed related accidents than trucks, so why isn't there people screaming from the roof-tops about cars not being speed limited to 110k/h?[/B]

Why do we have to bring in terms like sook because you could say that about anyone, truck drivers whinging about something or car drivers alike & it just degrades the discussion as it is a little derogatory, however yes car drivers speed also (I am one who does when overtaking or maybe a little on a nice road) though mostly I sit on the given speed limit but you know the difference?... My car or others cars do not do as much damage if things go wrong which can for a car or a truck though large trucks can kill many people in many cars all in 1 accident where a car is far less likely to do so unless you are on an autobahn & cause a huge pile up.

Also braking distances & the ability to avoid a collision is much easier in most cases with a car.

But is no excuse for excessive speeding done by young hoons etc apart from youth & the lack of wisdom that often comes with it.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Theres plenty of car drivers that do just as bad things to truck drivers.

If only people were a little more considerate themselves... Truck driving is a tough gig especially around the city... Out in the bush its easy, theres less traffic and more room on the roads, but around the city it can be a very frustrating job.

Another thing we need to enforce in this country is the keep left rule. Im sick to death of idiots that sit in the middle lane who aren't overtaking, or who are going slowing then the right lane.. They need to be put off the road if they cannot understand that basic rule.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Seduce XR6

Also braking distances & the ability to avoid a collision is much easier in most cases with a car.

Avoiding an accident, isn’t always possible regardless of whatever vehicle you’re driving, and let’s face it. Some people are just plain crap drivers.

I had this happen in front of me yesterday, and surprise surprise, I managed to avoid him but it could have very easily ended up badly if the Toyota driver lost control, but thankfully, he didn’t. What would have happened here if he lost control and I couldn’t avoid him? Another truck related fatality perhaps? Who would the media blame here, that big bad truck driver?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7gel1rqAcE

Getting back to the OP, put simply, the truck driver was put in an unavoidable situation, because of the impetuous actions of an inept driver. It’s as simple as that.

Sometimes, there’s just nothing you can do.

[BIGJB]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7gel1rqAcE

I am willing to bet the guy in towing the trailer had to change his undies after that happened.

[blackf6]

another rule that is grossly missunderstood by the car drivers is the signs on the back of trucks stating do not overtake turning vehicles. driving a truck in the city in like being a large cow with little fly's buzzing all around you with no regard to you actually trying to make a manouver.