According to Drive Ranger XL and XLS are not selling?

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by barra240t

Sort of correct, zero interest from private/small business buyers, incorrect with platinum and government departments, they are on a different level so they usually will only buy XL product.

I didn’t dismiss platinum as it is high series……

Governments buying XL Ranger?
Not when they can get cheaper 2WD and 4WD Utes from other manufacturers.
That’s why Ford only sells 300 odd 2WD Rangers a month

[simon varley]

the single turbo is still a really good engine. I think the problem might be that it wasn't available here in PX3 (I think?) and nobody is game to give it a drive to find out

[prydey]

Originally Posted by simon varley

the single turbo is still a really good engine. I think the problem might be that it wasn't available here in PX3 (I think?) and nobody is game to give it a drive to find out

125kw and 405Nm and still sent to the wheels via a 6sp...

My territory has better specs and its 10years old.

Toyota offer the 2.8 in everything except possibly workmate 4x2, and around $10k cheaper.

Why not offer a bare bones model that still has the same ability (towing etc) as more premium models?

I'd find it hard to believe if it was claimed to not be profitable for them.

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by simon varley

the single turbo is still a really good engine. I think the problem might be that it wasn't available here in PX3 (I think?) and nobody is game to give it a drive to find out

Unless it produces some amazing economy. its just doesn't have enough torque compared to the competition.

perhaps the 2.3 ecoboost with todays diesel prices would be a better option.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by prydey

125kw and 405Nm and still sent to the wheels via a 6sp...

My territory has better specs and its 10years old.

Toyota offer the 2.8 in everything except possibly workmate 4x2, and around $10k cheaper.

Why not offer a bare bones model that still has the same ability (towing etc) as more premium models?

I'd find it hard to believe if it was claimed to not be profitable for them.

Don't Toyota have a smaller 2.4 TD in cheaper grades? I'm pretty sure they do.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Don't Toyota have a smaller 2.4 TD in cheaper grades? I'm pretty sure they do.

Yeah its in workmate - 2.4L TD 110Kw/400Nm

So its worse than whats on offer in the new Ranger.

4x2 Hi-Rider Hilux Workmate Single Cab w 2.4L TD - $35,729 DA - you can't go non hi-rider variant in 4x2.

4x4 in normal spec Hilux Workmate single cab w 2.4L TD - $46,705 DA - what an absolute joke for that ****box. This is the only way you can get the non hi-rider variant in diesel.

The 2.4L TD is about $3000 more than the 2.7L unleaded variation.

Given the price of diesel compared to unleaded it makes you wonder if its worth the $3000 premium.

Whats 4x2 Ranger XL single cab w 2.0L TD worth?

I don't think they even do a single cab - its not on their build and price on their website? Why would you not have a single cab Ranger?

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Yeah its in workmate - 2.4L TD 110Kw/400Nm

So its worse than whats on offer in the new Ranger.

4x2 Hi-Rider Hilux Workmate Single Cab w 2.4L TD - $35,729 DA - you can't go non hi-rider variant in 4x2.

4x4 in normal spec Hilux Workmate single cab w 2.4L TD - $46,705 DA - what an absolute joke for that ****box. This is the only way you can get the non hi-rider variant in diesel.

The 2.4L TD is about $3000 more than the 2.7L unleaded variation.

Given the price of diesel compared to unleaded it makes you wonder if its worth the $3000 premium.

Whats 4x2 Ranger XL single cab w 2.0L TD worth?

I don't think they even do a single cab - its not on their build and price on their website? Why would you not have a single cab Ranger?

The budget ute is all about cost of ownership, Im an advocate for the diesel despite the 3 grand premium, but todays diesel prices sort of screws that theory.
the unleaded would be the better option, especially if the diesel is a slug

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

4x4 in normal spec Hilux Workmate single cab w 2.4L TD - $46,705 DA - what an absolute joke for that ****box. This is the only way you can get the non hi-rider variant in diesel.

Is it really Franco, I'd have said the bigger joke was that Toyota ask that because Aussies are stupid enough to pay it, can hardly blame the manufacturers with that in mind.
Theres not a new car on the market worth what we get asked but whilst we continue to accept being shafted they'll gladly oblige.
If people got over themselves and refused to pay the inflated figures the price would come down which is exactly whats happening with XL/S right now.
Ford arent going to abandon our market for Ranger if its one of their biggest so refusing to pay rediculous premiums will only result in those profits being trimmed to keep the volume moving.

Problem is, Aussies spend big to remain relevant amongst their peers be it houses or cars.

Stupidity at its finest from the smartest people in the room apparently.

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Whats 4x2 Ranger XL single cab w 2.0L TD worth?

I don't think they even do a single cab - its not on their build and price on their website? Why would you not have a single cab Ranger?

My Local Ford dealer has a couple of New 4x4 single cab rangers in His Holding Yard..

[barra240t]

Originally Posted by simon varley

the single turbo is still a really good engine. I think the problem might be that it wasn't available here in PX3 (I think?) and nobody is game to give it a drive to find out

It is, more than enough for a run about or work ute, I think the negativity towards it are from the people who are going to be towing warriors and are going to go four wheel driving every second week which, in reality, they never actually go four wheel driving or tow anything?

Also, Transit Custom has been doing fine as a work van using it.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by barra240t

It is, more than enough for a run about or work ute, I think the negativity towards it are from the people who are going to be towing warriors and are going to go four wheel driving every second week which, in reality, they never actually go four wheel driving or tow anything?

That’s not the issue, the problem Ford have with Ranger XL is that it’s not on the target audience’s list.

[.:4:.]

Im still unsure as to why the basic ute pretty much is a thing of the past. I had a base 2013 2.2L ranger, single cab low rider, 6 speed manual as a work car. Would i buy one as a personal car? Nope. Yes it was not fast, however it did what it needed to do very well. It had a canopy on the back so could carry heaps of stock and tools. I frequently towed +- 2 tonnes with it and it did that sorta ok. Interior wise it was nice enough, vynal floors for a work ute is a good thing. No touch screen radio, again for a work ute thats a good thing.
That got replaced in december 2019 with a new storm trooper triton. So probably the cheapest diesel ute on the market. Still 2wd, but they all are hi riders and again single cab. This one was a cab chassis but had a nice caddy service body put on the back. Similar basic interior, but a touch screen radio (smudge screen), but this one was an auto. For the kays i did at that job, the auto was nice. I still reckon the clutch and gearbox in the ranger are the best i have had for a manual. the extra power of the mitsubishi 2.4 diesel was noticeable. Still towed as frequently the same sized trailers and it was nicer to tow with, probably due to being an auto. The main detractor about the storm trooper was, well, god they are ugly.
But both those utes were everything you need and a little more. Not luxury an any form of the word, but comfortable seats, drove good but only loaded, served the utility purpose perfectly fine. I did manage to get my old manager to spill the cost of both those basic utes one day. 2.2 XL ranger with the canopy, 31k. Storm trooper diesel auto with service body, 37k. The mitsubishi was run out pricing though for the base cab chassis.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by .:4:.

Im still unsure as to why the basic ute pretty much is a thing of the past.

I had a base 2013 2.2L ranger, single cab low rider, 6 speed manual as a work car. Would i buy one as a personal car? Nope. Yes it was not fast, however it did what it needed to do very well. It had a canopy on the back so could carry heaps of stock and tools. I frequently towed +- 2 tonnes with it and it did that sorta ok. Interior wise it was nice enough, vynal floors for a work ute is a good thing. No touch screen radio, again for a work ute thats a good thing.
That got replaced in december 2019 with a new storm trooper triton. So probably the cheapest diesel ute on the market. Still 2wd, but they all are hi riders and again single cab. This one was a cab chassis but had a nice caddy service body put on the back. Similar basic interior, but a touch screen radio (smudge screen), but this one was an auto. For the kays i did at that job, the auto was nice. I still reckon the clutch and gearbox in the ranger are the best i have had for a manual. the extra power of the mitsubishi 2.4 diesel was noticeable. Still towed as frequently the same sized trailers and it was nicer to tow with, probably due to being an auto. The main detractor about the storm trooper was, well, god they are ugly.
But both those utes were everything you need and a little more. Not luxury an any form of the word, but comfortable seats, drove good but only loaded, served the utility purpose perfectly fine. I did manage to get my old manager to spill the cost of both those basic utes one day. 2.2 XL ranger with the canopy, 31k. Storm trooper diesel auto with service body, 37k. The mitsubishi was run out pricing though for the base cab chassis.

As I mentioned above, you’re in the segment of buyers who use their Utes to do work and carry things. Many now lease crew cab 4x4s as company vehicles that can tow a builders trailer during the week or jet skis on the weekend.

Ford and Toyota clearly besotted by strong buyer response/demand for those +$50k to $90k Utes and SUVs. The fish are literally jumping into the boat with orders to the middle of 2023 and growing.

The single cab XL with a basic single turbo 2.0 diesel is now so over priced for the target buyers,
Ford is not prepared to buy market share by slitting it own throat on prices but something tells me
that there’s a better way to do this. By ending all the 2.0 diesels and go V6 exclusive, that would
give XL buyers a reason to pick it over the other low rent pickups

[Franco Cozzo]

Another thing I didn't consider but Ranger Raptor at its price point entices RAM 1500 buyers back into their fold, where as before none of the Thailand Specials had a way of competing with the converted American utes, if you're ended up in a RAM1500 because you wanted a ute with some balls, but not necessarily its size then the Ranger Raptor has you covered - might snag a couple off the RAM 1500 a month easy.

Sure its not big numbers but its a few hundred extra sales you may have lost.

[.:4:.]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Another thing I didn't consider but Ranger Raptor at its price point entices RAM 1500 buyers back into their fold, where as before none of the Thailand Specials had a way of competing with the converted American utes, if you're ended up in a RAM1500 because you wanted a ute with some balls, but not necessarily its size then the Ranger Raptor has you covered - might snag a couple off the RAM 1500 a month easy.

Sure its not big numbers but its a few hundred extra sales you may have lost.

Yeah, but raptors, wildtracks, ram anything, they more likely wont be used as the intended purpose. So more status symbol then utility. Yeah, i see a few ram 1500s getting about in my area. They sound good being a pushrod v8. Never seen one with a canopy on the back, let alone a wheel barrow in the back or ladder racks on it.
Or even a scratch.
I dont understand the whole fancy ute thing.
Ute as a ute, yes. Ute as a luxo car but rides like a ute? To me that's just a bit silly. Exeption being if you cannot afford 2 cars so the work ute has to be the family car, in that case, well, you wont be trying to fake big manning it with a raptor or trx ram or whatever.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by .:4:.

Yeah, but raptors, wildtracks, ram anything, they more likely wont be used as the intended purpose. So more status symbol then utility. Yeah, i see a few ram 1500s getting about in my area. They sound good being a pushrod v8. Never seen one with a canopy on the back, let alone a wheel barrow in the back or ladder racks on it.
Or even a scratch.
I dont understand the whole fancy ute thing.
Ute as a ute, yes. Ute as a luxo car but rides like a ute? To me that's just a bit silly. Exeption being if you cannot afford 2 cars so the work ute has to be the family car, in that case, well, you wont be trying to fake big manning it with a raptor or trx ram or whatever.

Utes have always been the 'bogan coupe' at least in the last 30 years, what else would compete with a VE SS Ute or a XR6 Turbo for $40K DA or what ever they were in the late 2000s?

Add in tax advantages that they've brought in the last 20 years plus the dual cabs being the 'do everything' vehicle.

Also the American utes drive and ride a lot nicer than Thailand Specials so it's not as much of a concern getting around unloaded.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Another thing I didn't consider but Ranger Raptor at its price point entices RAM 1500 buyers back into their fold, where as before none of the Thailand Specials had a way of competing with the converted American utes, if you're ended up in a RAM1500 because you wanted a ute with some balls, but not necessarily its size then the Ranger Raptor has you covered - might snag a couple off the RAM 1500 a month easy.

Sure its not big numbers but its a few hundred extra sales you may have lost.

Internally, Ford was asking itself the same questions regarding full sized pickup sales
but it boils down to this, is it the size of the pickup or the engine……

The answer is yes and no because clearly, some buyers will be drawn back to Ranger Raptor
while others will buy F150 because of its added size.

[Big_Daz]

I saw a story on CarSales that VW are going to offer an Amarok Core V6D, which is pretty much XL/XLS spec. Be interested to see what they are charging and its popularity.

[.:4:.]

Well, mercedes tried that with the failure that was the x clasd. So yeah a rebadge of the nissan np300 navara and there was a pov spec single cab. Seen a few pov spec x class utes when new, but only out the front of the mercedes comercial dealership. I see the odd np300 navara on the roads, more d40s but still not many in comparison to the older d22 navaras. Dont see a huge amount of those either. Granted the d22 is now an old ute.
So i think mb went too hard too soon, which is a tad odd as vito's and sprinter vans are a common sight.
Cannot see vw getting a market share with the amarok. Partially due to the badge sharing with the current ranger and simply buyer perception. Badge sharing worked quite well with say the bt50 and ranger back then.

[Hulsty]

I've been working with some people in USA and Mexico, literally they were perplexed when I said I was in a different time zone and no I could not attended the 3am meeting.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Hmm I just bought an XL Super cab.

Base model 4x2 single Turbo in Grey. Came in at $54k..... What a joke!

The tray alone was nearly 7k tho, plus factory towbar with brake controller $1800, XLT side steps $1200 and a set of Wildtrak wheels $1200. I also added all plastics etc. It replaced a 2018 4x2 super cab which I just sold for 40k, so not too bad for at $14k change over I guess??

Would have been roughly 12k more for a 4x4 in the same guise with the Bi turbo. I just couldn't justify it or the wait.

[DFB FGXR6]

A lot in this thread has referenced the very entry level single cab chassis and 4x2 models, in particular Ford not wanting to pursue this end of the market due to lower profit margins.

Changing tact here, lets compare RRP's on base model 4x4 double-cab pickups, all automatic, all in white and no options.

Ford Ranger XL Double Cab 4x4 2.0 Single Turbo Auto - $55,051

https://www.ford.com.au/buy/build-an...=3CQZHincluded

Nissan Navara SL Dual Cab 4x4 2.3 Auto - $50,657

https://www.nissan.com.au/vehicles/b...ry/BAEl/A-ZRng

Mitsubishi Triton GLX Double Cab 4x4 2.4 Auto - $48,240

https://www.mitsubishi-motors.com.au...on=MR4W47-2023

Toyota Hilux Workmate Double Cab 4x4 2.4 Auto - $53,396

https://www.toyota.com.au/hilux/prices

Isuzu DMAX Double Cab SX 4x4 1.9 Auto - $55,197

https://www.isuzuute.com.au/build-an...ral-White/None

GWM Cannon Double Cab 4x4 2.0 Auto - $38,990

https://www.gwmhaval.com.au/config?model=ute

LDV don't have a build and price section, but the cheapest auto T60 is $43,148.
https://www.ldvautomotive.com.au/price/

The one that surprises me is the DMAX, so expensive for the 1.9 engine. The BT-50 is likewise as expensive.

But...................how is it determined that Ford are not reaping profits from a $55,000 base model 4X4 double cab?

Don't get me wrong, the Ranger is THE segment leader in most aspects, but its clear why Ford have excess stock of XL and XLS models............they are just too expensive for what they are.

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

The BT-50 is likewise as expensive.

.

Mate, I've cleaned My Glasses Twice & still can't see The Mazda BT50 Listed in your Post...??

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by hayseed

Mate, I've cleaned My Glasses Twice & still can't see The Mazda BT50 Listed in your Post...??

I didn't link it in my original post. This is the cheapest base 4x4 double cab -

Mazda BT50 XT Double Cab 4x4 3.0 Auto - $57,961

https://www.mazda.com.au/build/bt-50...DesignCode=ZEW

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

A lot in this thread has referenced the very entry level single cab chassis and 4x2 models, in particular Ford not wanting to pursue this end of the market due to lower profit margins.

Changing tact here, lets compare RRP's on base model 4x4 double-cab pickups, all automatic, all in white and no options.

Ford Ranger XL Double Cab 4x4 2.0 Single Turbo Auto - $55,051

https://www.ford.com.au/buy/build-an...=3CQZHincluded

Nissan Navara SL Dual Cab 4x4 2.3 Auto - $50,657

https://www.nissan.com.au/vehicles/b...ry/BAEl/A-ZRng

Mitsubishi Triton GLX Double Cab 4x4 2.4 Auto - $48,240

https://www.mitsubishi-motors.com.au...on=MR4W47-2023

Toyota Hilux Workmate Double Cab 4x4 2.4 Auto - $53,396

https://www.toyota.com.au/hilux/prices

Isuzu DMAX Double Cab SX 4x4 1.9 Auto - $55,197

https://www.isuzuute.com.au/build-an...ral-White/None

GWM Cannon Double Cab 4x4 2.0 Auto - $38,990

https://www.gwmhaval.com.au/config?model=ute

LDV don't have a build and price section, but the cheapest auto T60 is $43,148.
https://www.ldvautomotive.com.au/price/

The one that surprises me is the DMAX, so expensive for the 1.9 engine. The BT-50 is likewise as expensive.

But...................how is it determined that Ford are not reaping profits from a $55,000 base model 4X4 double cab?

Don't get me wrong, the Ranger is THE segment leader in most aspects, but its clear why Ford have excess stock of XL and XLS models............they are just too expensive for what they are.

I'd probably lean towards the Triton and upspec to GLX/R and use the chanhe for accessories.
Its no Ranger but its tried and proven and well appointed for the coin compared.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by Smoke Pursuit

Hmm I just bought an XL Super cab.

Base model 4x2 single Turbo in Grey. Came in at $54k..... What a joke!

The tray alone was nearly 7k tho, plus factory towbar with brake controller $1800, XLT side steps $1200 and a set of Wildtrak wheels $1200. I also added all plastics etc. It replaced a 2018 4x2 super cab which I just sold for 40k, so not too bad for at $14k change over I guess??

Would have been roughly 12k more for a 4x4 in the same guise with the Bi turbo. I just couldn't justify it or the wait.

Just an update on this, went to look at my new XL yesterday, while I was there I noticed a v6 xlt cab chassis in Silver….. undriven demo ready to go. Came home with it. 15k more than the XL, but a more basic tray.

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by Smoke Pursuit

Just an update on this, went to look at my new XL yesterday, while I was there I noticed a v6 xlt cab chassis in Silver….. undriven demo ready to go. Came home with it. 15k more than the XL, but a more basic tray.

$69K for a 4x2 Supercab??? or have I missed something..??

[Big_Daz]

Originally Posted by hayseed

$69K for a 4x2 Supercab??? or have I missed something..??

The $69k was for an XLT Dual Cab (but cab chassis, rather than stylside) V6D so pricing is about right.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by Big_Daz

The $69k was for an XLT Dual Cab (but cab chassis, rather than stylside) V6D so pricing is about right.

Correct. V6 cab chassis in silver with all terrains, tray and all plastics!

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Smoke Pursuit

Just an update on this, went to look at my new XL yesterday, while I was there I noticed a v6 xlt cab chassis in Silver….. undriven demo ready to go. Came home with it. 15k more than the XL, but a more basic tray.

And that’s how selling is done, you go in with one plan and come home with a different vehicle…..

Congratulations on your new purchase.