What the hell is going wrong with some of us Men??… - Page 2

GT · 29-10-2009, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Some very good points here guys.

Id be very interested to hear from some of our female members about how they perceive the way some men relate towards them, and women in general, especially in social situations..?

Norm, I said to Russell earlier this morning that I would watch this thread and maybe not comment, however your invitation has seduced me!

As a girl growing up, I had VERY strict parents that were what appeared sometimes a bit over the top and too protective, it did keep me safe and on the straight and narrow. I was involved in a world where there are many dangers (modelling) and the boundaries and rules I had learned, gave me the skills to survive. I was always proactive and never put myself in any situation where something could possibly go pear-shaped out of fear of my father more than the danger to myself.

I went on to have 3 sons of my own and I taught them that it is just as important for a boy to keep yourself safe, as it is a girl. There are many strange queer folk out there. I was a tough hard mother and my youngest recently said to me that I was not like other Mums (hard to be soft and fuzzy when you are raising 3 sons alone) but compared to his friends he has lifeskills that they may never learn and he thanked me for that. I am proud to say that my 3 sons who are all in their 20s now are good young men that have a great respect for women and have always had the courage and strength to stand up against 'pack' mentality. Yes, I used the wooden spoon and I raised them like my parents and grandparents did previous generations. I would be in trouble today for this but maybe they would not be the fine young men they are, had I not. We will never know.

I do not understand why young women continue to put themselves in vulnerable positions that endanger their wellbeing. Yes, I understand that they feel it is a right to be safe wherever they choose to be but the reality is not this simple. All children need to be taught from an early age to err on the side of caution (particularly girls) and not get into any situation where things can go very wrong and they lose control. Always be proactive and sober so you are in control of the situation and the decisions you make. We all know that you don't take drinks from someone elses hand, always keep your thumb over the top of your bottle. if you leave your drink unattended - leave it where it is sitting and buy a new one etc etc. I could go on all day - do people tell kids these things now or do they choose to ignore it?

I am fast approaching 50 and I still keep myself safe. Russell recently set all the doors in the GT and Ute so that when I am on my own the doors automatically lock. I am careful what I wear and where I wear it and do not put myself on 'display' like many women do these days. To be honest the figure isn't what it used to be anyway!

I didn't have girls and I am quite critical of the way many people dress and display their wee girls like sexual objects. Some girls 10 to 13 are dressing like adults and clothing that I find distasteful anyway - yes, I am a bit conservative! Have you read some of the T Shirts they are wearing?

In summary, this is not just about 16 boys raping 2 teenage girls. It is about a world that I don't relate to anymore. Porn, sex parties etc seem to now be socially acceptable and we have it all around us with TV, movies, the Internet and even people we know.

I sound like my mother - oh God!

Gaela

Franco Cozzo · 29-10-2009, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EDfutura25

Same here. I had a few mates who were real low lifes but they would never stoop this low.

People like this should rot in jail for 25yrs minimum but alas our stupid legal system will give them nothing more than a slap on the wrist, sure they will (I hope) get jail time but it won't be sufficient to deter them. Whilst sometimes I disagree with the way other countries laws work, there are times I agree. In the U.S they would basically rot in jail for this, in other countries they would be shot. Maybe if our laws were not so crap people would be detered.

The general population in jail doesn't tend to take crimes against women lightly, even though they're all scumbags, most still have a sense of morality. Though I do agree, more jailtime would be good, but it won't happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 99GHIA

At a cost of about 50k per year per inmate, times that by 25years $1,250000
times that by the 16 involved $20,000,000. Cost of 16 5 meter lengths of
decent rope is all of what $200 tops. Think the solution is right there.

How about a 10 cent bullet? Line them up and you could probably get it done with 2.

No wait, we'll let the general population inside the prison kill them, they'll enjoy it and it'll be free.

MAD · 29-10-2009, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 99GHIA

I blame the do gooders and greenies holy and soly for this sort of behaviour.
For those of us who are a little older remember back to the days when smaking
children was ok, when getting the cane or strap or ruler at school was a part of
our disipilne. We knew the boundries we knew the lines and where they were
drawn. We didn't in most case stray to far over those lines because we knew
the consequences if we did. With this disipline we also learnt respect which is
what is missing in this picture and most of society today.

There in lies the problem.
No one seems to be learning what consequences are. Sitting on a chair for 5mins is not consequences.

pottery beige · 29-10-2009, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTGTP

Norm, I said to Russell earlier this morning that I would watch this thread and maybe not comment, however your invitation has seduced me!

As a girl growing up, I had VERY strict parents that were what appeared sometimes a bit over the top and too protective, it did keep me safe and on the straight and narrow. I was involved in a world where there are many dangers (modelling) and the boundaries and rules I had learned, gave me the skills to survive. I was always proactive and never put myself in any situation where something could possibly go pear-shaped out of fear of my father more than the danger to myself.

I went on to have 3 sons of my own and I taught them that it is just as important for a boy to keep yourself safe, as it is a girl. There are many strange queer folk out there. I was a tough hard mother and my youngest recently said to me that I was not like other Mums (hard to be soft and fuzzy when you are raising 3 sons alone) but compared to his friends he has lifeskills that they may never learn and he thanked me for that. I am proud to say that my 3 sons who are all in their 20s now are good young men that have a great respect for women and have always had the courage and strength to stand up against 'pack' mentality. Yes, I used the wooden spoon and I raised them like my parents and grandparents did previous generations. I would be in trouble today for this but maybe they would not be the fine young men they are, had I not. We will never know.

I do not understand why young women continue to put themselves in vulnerable positions that endanger their wellbeing. Yes, I understand that they feel it is a right to be safe wherever they choose to be but the reality is not this simple. All children need to be taught from an early age to err on the side of caution (particularly girls) and not get into any situation where things can go very wrong and they lose control. Always be proactive and sober so you are in control of the situation and the decisions you make. We all know that you don't take drinks from someone elses hand, always keep your thumb over the top of your bottle. if you leave your drink unattended - leave it where it is sitting and buy a new one etc etc. I could go on all day - do people tell kids these things now or do they choose to ignore it?

I am fast approaching 50 and I still keep myself safe. Russell recently set all the doors in the GT and Ute so that when I am on my own the doors automatically lock. I am careful what I wear and where I wear it and do not put myself on 'display' like many women do these days. To be honest the figure isn't what it used to be anyway!

I didn't have girls and I am quite critical of the way many people dress and display their wee girls like sexual objects. Some girls 10 to 13 are dressing like adults and clothing that I find distasteful anyway - yes, I am a bit conservative! Have you read some of the T Shirts they are wearing?

In summary, this is not just about 16 boys raping 2 teenage girls. It is about a world that I don't relate to anymore. Porn, sex parties etc seem to now be socially acceptable and we have it all around us with TV, movies, the Internet and even people we know.

I sound like my mother - oh God!

Gaela

Post of the year Gaela, there is way to much emphasis on little girl's not being little girl's anymore and maybe not being equipped with the life skill's to avoid situation's like this. Same goes for the male generation it think alot are missing out on a good 'moral' grounding, respect and attitudes toward's other's.

tex · 29-10-2009, 12:37 PM

I'm not yet 40, but damned if I can relate to the way these boys of 17 - 20 act, think and possess as a set of life values and boundaries.

I know quite a few, and I consider myself to be young at heart, but jesus, I am at a loss over the way so many of this generation relate to the rest of society, and the world as a whole.

I have no answeres, I wish I did. I have my own view on how the apparent rot can be treated - but as has been mentioned, do gooding tree hugging, 'rights of children' types have ensured that corporal punishment is now illegal.

A starting point to stem the rot - national Service for 12 months! Or at LEAST, Service Reserves. Teach these grotty little no hopers, the meaning of respect for fellow man, instill some old fashioned ideals of courtesy and respect - in particular for women. But they lack respect for their fellow men as well, so fix that at the same time.

Aside from the shock of 16 people pack raping a couple of young women, I am lost for words how there can come a situation where not one of these 'boys' was infact MAN enough to do something about it.

Peer group pressure? Please, get some freaken nuts you soft $%&*&. Anyone of those cockroaches could have rung the Police. or told the neighbours to ring them, seeing as though their manliness could not be extended to tackling the instigators themselves.

Back when I was that age, if ANY of my 'mates' had advocated (yet alone participated) in this kind of behaviour, the rest of us would have rectified them. And Oon more than one occassion, the 'group' did self regulate. Nowadays - seems it doesn't happen.....?

Hope mums and dads of these cockroaches do what needs to be done.

I know what my old man would have done, and I know what he'd still do at the age of 69.

He'd bust me up. He'd belt the living dung from my carcass, and if he didn't think he could do it - he'd get help from someone.

Cockroaches should be squashed.

If Ive offended anyone reading, sorry for that, but I take back nothing typed in the last 5 minutes. I mean it all.

**cs123** · 29-10-2009, 12:48 PM

I think you need to separate this behaviour to the "youth of today" sentiments people hold

This is a classic quote attributed to Plato
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"

So it's been going on a few thousand years. Your parent's generation though similar of you, etc etc.

As for the sexual predators being more prevalent now days think about the legacy of a few generations ago with orphans being raped by their carers. I think the chances of sexual abuse being reported these days being much higher than in generation past.

Still doesn't excuse the behaviour, don't know if the pack rapes are a "trend" but I hope it gets stamped out soon.

gtfpv · 29-10-2009, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

16 Charged over "pack" Rape:

http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/s...006301,00.html

There has been literally dozens of these cases over the past 12 months...

Well I’m not sure how or what to say but this sickens me to the core, and to be honest I’ve had enough of reading about these kinds of things.
What’s going wrong with society in Australia? What’s going wrong in the minds of some Youths/Men...? especially when they get together in groups?
Why doesn’t at-least 1 of them have a conscience and be a man and stop this from happening? 16 guys involved????
Why do some think its ok to disrespect women like this? I’m fed up with it… it’s about time as a society and as individuals we take a stronger pro active stand against this kind of behavior.
Women can and should not “trust” human nature in what should be a civilized safe society.
We're at a point where women need to avoid situations where they could be taken advantage of…
Come on guys... this is despicable..

totally agree 4Vman .

i must admit now that everything on tv nowadays is about sex. and women are the ones used to advertise it on tv . being a father i cannot stop my kids from seeing what is portrayed as normal these days . just watching movie music clips on saturday mornings these days my daughter and son get to see virtually naked women in every film clip . and women getting it on together . imagine what goes through a 16 year old boys mind seeing this from age 4 onwards . women are being pertrayed as hungry for sex on tv . we all know the reality is different a group of 16 year old girls might not think that going back to a party after a night out means there up for it , but boys might think the girls are up for it , because thats whats on tv every day .
what tv soap can you think of that doesnt have women kissing on it . even the nice ones .
i think people are being brought up to think casual sex is a part of life and women are up for it . just by what i see on tv today . and when sex crimes happen everyone appears to be insanely shocked !!

Green X · 29-10-2009, 01:50 PM

Thought if i should put this up or not but i think i will.
How does this happen..... i will tell you

Earlier this year i was working a night shift at a Gold mine bout 160km south of Perth for reasons i wont get into hear, The company had some of the night shift staying in a Hotel in Perth.

I would go to a 24houre gym in the CBD after shift about 4am, anyway I was walking back to the hotel after my workout bout 5am and came across these 2 girls who were somewhat drunk and looked a little lost. anyway after talking too these girls for a few minuets they asked if they could come back to my hotel with me, Naturally i said Yes LOL

We walked into the hotel and jumped in the elevator to go back to one of the guys rooms where 6 or 7 of my workmates were having a few beers.

when i actually got a look at these 2 girls in the light, they would have been 16 years old. I asked asked them how old are you 2??
18 was the reply, No ya not i said. yeah OK I'm 17 and my friend is 16.
Too paint the picture these girls were dressed in Hot Pants, High heals and tight tops with there Tits half hanging out, one had a RAUNCHY LADY'S Sticker running up her Leg. WTF!

I said you do realize your about to walk into a hotel room filled with 7 boozed up Mine workers don't you?? Yeah it'll be fun was the reply!!!

Anyhow, they did follow me into that room, lucky for them I'm not a Sicko and the guys i worked with at the time weren't either. They did have a Beer with us we then ordered them some breakfast and a Taxi to take them home.

But you should have heard some of the stuff these girls were talking about. Drugs they take, How guys like us would be a better roots than guys there age, what Clubs do we go too Etc

It was not cool but i was a major eye opener to what is going on with the younger generation and I'm only 24!!

V3RSAC3 · 29-10-2009, 01:51 PM

Yeah I'm sick off this too! ... You never hear about 16 women rapping a man! ... Tutt they leave that bit out!

Jason[98.EL] · 29-10-2009, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 99GHIA

At a cost of about 50k per year per inmate, times that by 25years $1,250000
times that by the 16 involved $20,000,000. Cost of 16 5 meter lengths of
decent rope is all of what $200 tops. Think the solution is right there.

Agree 100%

Bring bac capital punishment i say

Paddyboy · 29-10-2009, 02:07 PM

Quote:

There has been literally dozens of these cases over the past 12 months...

Well I’m not sure how or what to say but this sickens me to the core, and to be honest I’ve had enough of reading about these kinds of things.
What’s going wrong with society in Australia? What’s going wrong in the minds of some Youths/Men...? especially when they get together in groups?
Why doesn’t at-least 1 of them have a conscience and be a man and stop this from happening? 16 guys involved????
Why do some think its ok to disrespect women like this? I’m fed up with it… it’s about time as a society and as individuals we take a stronger pro active stand against this kind of behavior.
Women can and should not “trust” human nature in what should be a civilized safe society.
We're at a point where women need to avoid situations where they could be taken advantage of…
Come on guys... this is despicable..

I totally agree with you.

I want to talk about this from a footballers persepctive as I am a footy player at a local club that I wont mention. While stuff like this scenario with the 2 girls and 16 guys hasnt happened at my club, I honestly wouldnt be suprised if it did one day.

I love my footy and I love my footy mates but I am 26 and was raised with a high respect for women and people in general and with discipline. The stuff that goes on at footy club functions only shows guys (especially the young ones) that treating women like sexual objects is ok. We've had strippers, parties etc and when you get 50 ****ed blokes together all with the same thing on their minds, things can go terribly wrong.

I always took a stance at my footy club, along with a few others and refused to go to these events and explained why. I honestly believe that a lot of footy clubs and end of season trips like the one in the news, are just ticking timb bombs for worse stuff to happen.

The older generation are letting this happen and its not good enough, we should all be setting an example of appropriate behaviour to the younger generation as they look up to us. We all have to see ourselves as leaders and stand up for what we know is right.

The thing that upsets me the most with this is that at my footy club I am about in the middle when it comes to age bracket, but the guys older then me just encouraged this bad behaviour, even the coach.

Remember, nothing changes unless people make a stand. You can only do what you can with what youve got, so just remember this next time you're in a situation where this topic comes up or when you see something bad about to happen, speak up. We all have something to say.
Its a pity none of those montmerency boys stood up against their mates making the wrong decision, because now they are shamed for life, regardless of the sentences they will get, and now the footy club will always be remembered for this.

**Polyal** · 29-10-2009, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Green X

Thought if i should put this up or not but i think i will.
How does this happen..... i will tell you

Earlier this year i was working a night shift at a Gold mine bout 160km south of Perth for reasons i wont get into hear, The company had some of the night shift staying in a Hotel in Perth.

I would go to a 24houre gym in the CBD after shift about 4am, anyway I was walking back to the hotel after my workout bout 5am and came across these 2 girls who were somewhat drunk and looked a little lost. anyway after talking too these girls for a few minuets they asked if they could come back to my hotel with me, Naturally i said Yes LOL

We walked into the hotel and jumped in the elevator to go back to one of the guys rooms where 6 or 7 of my workmates were having a few beers.

when i actually got a look at these 2 girls in the light, they would have been 16 years old. I asked asked them how old are you 2??
18 was the reply, No ya not i said. yeah OK I'm 17 and my friend is 16.
Too paint the picture these girls were dressed in Hot Pants, High heals and tight tops with there Tits half hanging out, one had a RAUNCHY LADY'S Sticker running up her Leg. WTF!

I said you do realize your about to walk into a hotel room filled with 7 boozed up Mine workers don't you?? Yeah it'll be fun was the reply!!!

Anyhow, they did follow me into that room, lucky for them I'm not a Sicko and the guys i worked with at the time weren't either. They did have a Beer with us we then ordered them some breakfast and a Taxi to take them home.

But you should have heard some of the stuff these girls were talking about. Drugs they take, How guys like us would be a better roots than guys there age, what Clubs do we go too Etc

It was not cool but i was a major eye opener to what is going on with the younger generation and I'm only 24!!

There is no doubt there is a problem with controling girls and what they wear. You just have to go to the mall and see how they tart up at a young age.

So it begs the question do the parents know? Are they the ones buying their princess' makeup and short skirts?

Obviously thats not the only issue here, so many angles that you can take to see whats wrong. And Im not saying that the girls/women bring it on themselves, just incase someone thinks that.

As for peer pressure, I dont know what its like being a teenager now but I am 26 and for a short period I took up smoking. All my mates would rip into me, move away etc until I just stopped. I dont know why I did it but started and stopped within a 3 month period.

Oh and that was just cigarettes, not pot.

Another issue that scares me is the access to information. I roll my eyes when I hear hippes go on about it but there is some truth to it. I get taken back at times with some of the subjects kids (KIDS! like under 10) talk about. I dont think I had a clue of some of the topics, didn't even know it existed, I was to busy kicking the footy or playing cricket.

So there is no silver bullet but jeez there seems to be issues everywhere.

**Falcon Coupe** · 29-10-2009, 06:12 PM

I'll reserve comment until they are convicted.

gtfpv · 29-10-2009, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Green X

Thought if i should put this up or not but i think i will.
How does this happen..... i will tell you

Earlier this year i was working a night shift at a Gold mine bout 160km south of Perth for reasons i wont get into hear, The company had some of the night shift staying in a Hotel in Perth.

I would go to a 24houre gym in the CBD after shift about 4am, anyway I was walking back to the hotel after my workout bout 5am and came across these 2 girls who were somewhat drunk and looked a little lost. anyway after talking too these girls for a few minuets they asked if they could come back to my hotel with me, Naturally i said Yes LOL

We walked into the hotel and jumped in the elevator to go back to one of the guys rooms where 6 or 7 of my workmates were having a few beers.

when i actually got a look at these 2 girls in the light, they would have been 16 years old. I asked asked them how old are you 2??
18 was the reply, No ya not i said. yeah OK I'm 17 and my friend is 16.
Too paint the picture these girls were dressed in Hot Pants, High heals and tight tops with there Tits half hanging out, one had a RAUNCHY LADY'S Sticker running up her Leg. WTF!

I said you do realize your about to walk into a hotel room filled with 7 boozed up Mine workers don't you?? Yeah it'll be fun was the reply!!!

Anyhow, they did follow me into that room, lucky for them I'm not a Sicko and the guys i worked with at the time weren't either. They did have a Beer with us we then ordered them some breakfast and a Taxi to take them home.

But you should have heard some of the stuff these girls were talking about. Drugs they take, How guys like us would be a better roots than guys there age, what Clubs do we go too Etc

It was not cool but i was a major eye opener to what is going on with the younger generation and I'm only 24!!

thats very interesting . i guess the girls are seeing stuff on tv as well and have a preconceiived idea of how free and cool the idea of casual sex can be . but you could imagine what happens would totally change there perception when the reality sets in , and the guilt and innocence of what happened the night before the next day sets in . would lead and does lead to men being charged .

a friend of mines neice came to stay with him and his wife from iterstate and got caught up in a very similar circumstance , the next day she was very very upset at what she participated in , my friend rang the police and charges were laid against many men , after the findings though ,the 2 women were found to be willing participents on the night and were just as guilty so all charges were dropped . however the mens reputations were exposed to thier families etc .
my friend said he believes the men were caught up and lead on by the girls , one of them being his inexperienced neice,(aged 19 ) he felt for all involved and was glad that the men did not get sentenced as the girls were equally guilty .
he had to explain to the neice that she should have known better and did not deserve priveledged pardon just because they were female and shed a few tears the next day .

BPXR6T · 29-10-2009, 07:29 PM

A certain member of my family was beaten up by her husband. We kept authorities out of it and handled it in house. Gutless coward plain and simple. Never seen a "man" cry so much, even before a hand was laid on him.

Mark^^ · 29-10-2009, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

I really dont get it either. Not only is it sick its freaking gay,

I object to the use of the term 'gay' in relation to this nasty sort of stuff.

Yellow_Festiva · 29-10-2009, 07:36 PM

The reason why people continue to do this is for 1 reason. Because they know that they can use our weak legal system to their advantage to lower their sentence for whatever reason a savy lawyer / doctor can find.

There is no fear or respect for the law, and the people who enforce it.

What is the answer? MINIMUM sentences. Having fines / jail sentences that start with "from" not "up to".

If you came from another country for a 'better life' and were proven to have done anything above a certain severity of crime then the punishment should be a fine and deportation with a 'never to enter' stamp on their file. No if's / buts.

Stuff putting these people in jails here for a cost of whatever it is a year. We buy 90% of our stuff from Asia because they can do it cheaper. So, pay China / Thailand / Indonesia $20 grand a year to keep them locked away and provide them with a living pen and 3 squares. They would JUMP at the opportunity.

How bout this. After you get out, you have then voided your right to get any sort of government help. Nothing, Nil. No medicare. No pension. You have caused a drain on the community due to your own inactions, so you pay for it.

Seems harsh doesn't it? But would that scare you into complying with the law however? I would be pertified. And if you think it wouldn't work, what happens to the roads every time double demerits pops up?

Look at what Singapore does to people who do petty crimes. They BEAT them. Out comes the good old cane and they go hard till the blood flows. I have been to Singapore several times now. The trains have not 1 mark, peoples property is left alone and respected, the place is clean as can be, considering the density of the population.

Off Rant....

paule11 · 29-10-2009, 07:47 PM

They should not call them men real men dont rape or beat women.
Real men dont hunt in packs trying to find someone weaker to beat up.
Straight men would not be comfortable being in a room with a cupboard against the door with other naked males with erections.
Real men take responsibility for their actions and treat others with respect and have the guts to stand up as an individual.

Jesk · 29-10-2009, 07:58 PM

people proved guilty of sex crimes or murder and the like loose the right to be considered people, that makes them an animal, and thus can be put down like one!

Windsor220 · 29-10-2009, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Green X

Thought if i should put this up or not but i think i will.
How does this happen..... i will tell you

Earlier this year i was working a night shift at a Gold mine bout 160km south of Perth for reasons i wont get into hear, The company had some of the night shift staying in a Hotel in Perth.

I would go to a 24houre gym in the CBD after shift about 4am, anyway I was walking back to the hotel after my workout bout 5am and came across these 2 girls who were somewhat drunk and looked a little lost. anyway after talking too these girls for a few minuets they asked if they could come back to my hotel with me, Naturally i said Yes LOL

We walked into the hotel and jumped in the elevator to go back to one of the guys rooms where 6 or 7 of my workmates were having a few beers.

when i actually got a look at these 2 girls in the light, they would have been 16 years old. I asked asked them how old are you 2??
18 was the reply, No ya not i said. yeah OK I'm 17 and my friend is 16.
Too paint the picture these girls were dressed in Hot Pants, High heals and tight tops with there Tits half hanging out, one had a RAUNCHY LADY'S Sticker running up her Leg. WTF!

I said you do realize your about to walk into a hotel room filled with 7 boozed up Mine workers don't you?? Yeah it'll be fun was the reply!!!

Anyhow, they did follow me into that room, lucky for them I'm not a Sicko and the guys i worked with at the time weren't either. They did have a Beer with us we then ordered them some breakfast and a Taxi to take them home.

But you should have heard some of the stuff these girls were talking about. Drugs they take, How guys like us would be a better roots than guys there age, what Clubs do we go too Etc

It was not cool but i was a major eye opener to what is going on with the younger generation and I'm only 24!!

Yeah the girls arent helping the matter sometimes. Not that Im sticking up for these guys or anything.
Just a few weeks ago me and a workmate had a bit of a night out so were a bit drunk when we left to go home. There was a just turned 18 year old girl in the taxi line sitting on the ground. She had a bit to drink. When she saw us she started talking to us asking to go somewhere else because she didnt want to go home yet. I couldnt be bothered but my mate wanted so all 3 of us taxied it somewhere else. Now we could of been anyone but she didnt seem to care.

GT · 29-10-2009, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jesk

people proved guilty of sex crimes or murder and the like loose the right to be considered people, that makes them an animal, and thus can be put down like one!

You will find the animal kingdom does not behave like this. They have the rules of nature which is specific to them and abide by that code. Sadly we struggle to achieve this.

Mark - I'm sure Polyal just used the word carelessly. I winced when I saw it myself but a lot of people use the word for many purposes. I feel sure it was referring to something else. Many years ago the word was only used for being happy, then it was used to describe someone's sexual orientation and now used as a modern word for something people do not approve of - without actually making a statement about sexual preferences. My children used it so often that my gay friends got used to it and teased them about it.

Gaela

**buggerlugs** · 29-10-2009, 08:25 PM

Read any of the Newspapers in the country and see the crimes commited and the sentences given. Read all the blogs, the same thing. People disgusted with the leniant sentences given. Crims given 3 , 4 or even 5 chances to better themselves. Or given the good old "suspended sentence". And don't forget the poor crims devastating backgrounds from which they where brought up in, blah blah blah............What about the VICTIMS ??? It's a joke..............

4Vman · 29-10-2009, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windsor220

Yeah the girls arent helping the matter sometimes. Not that Im sticking up for these guys or anything.
Just a few weeks ago me and a workmate had a bit of a night out so were a bit drunk when we left to go home. There was a just turned 18 year old girl in the taxi line sitting on the ground. She had a bit to drink. When she saw us she started talking to us asking to go somewhere else because she didnt want to go home yet. I couldnt be bothered but my mate wanted so all 3 of us taxied it somewhere else. Now we could of been anyone but she didnt seem to care.

Some "men" like to prey on drunk, young, vulnerable or naive women... some are a combination of all.
A young scantily clad girl flirting is just that, its risky and dangerous given the world out there now, but its not an open invitation.
Some prey on this, call it "Opportunism" if you will... ive seen it first hand.
REAL men don't do it.
Id never want to confuse this scenario with women who "cry wolf" after the fact due to guilt though.. that's a totally different topic.

Geez Louise · 29-10-2009, 09:34 PM

My son is 22 now but I remember we allowed him to go to a party that was literally at the end of the street when he was 16 on the grounds that he would come home by 10pm.

He comes running home at 9.55pm and BEGGED us to let him go back to the party till 10.30pm as the guys and girls at this party were drinking and they were doing things they were going to regret.

He went back to the party and called every girls parent to come and pick them up. Did he lose alot of friends? Yes he did but to this day, there is one girl who he still sees when he is out and about and she still thanks him everytime she sees him for calling her dad that night.

I am not saying my son is an angel but he has moments that makes me so very proud of the fine young man I have raised.

It is down to parenting. You teach your kids right from wrong and they follow what is taught. Lead by example. We have a hard line with our sons but it is for their own good. My eldest son sees it and in time my younger one will too....just as I did with my parents.

This shows how bad things have gotten when this kind of situation goes on. In fact my youngest told his school recently that I didnt allow him HIS freedom. He is 13 and we do not allow him to go to friends houses after school during the week.

They got a councellor in and we had to go to the school to explain why. I tell you right now after 15mins that guy was in shock at how we discipline our son. There is no hitting, just punishment (you lose your bedroom door, mobile phone priveledges taken away) until acknowledgement is made by my son for his actions. The councellor STILL advised our youngest that there are other steps he can take....What a crock!!

Parents need to be more aware of what their kids are doing. Some of these young men were under 18...were is their guidance?? Peer pressure too much??

I feel sick reading about this incident.

Back in my youth, we had heros that we looked up to and aspired to be. Who can these young men aspire to be when media only portray stories that sell headlines?

It is indeed a sad world we live in...

FPV8U · 29-10-2009, 09:54 PM

Don't really know where to start on this one..

I'm 21 and around the Target age that's being talked about, i was brought up with my Single mother until the age of 10 and would think i have above average respect for women and their rights than the average man.

The sad fact of the matter is "Drunk" gets thrown around like an all stations pass for this type of behavior, while i would like to think the that my friends would not be involved in something like the above mentioned article.

I have seen, like every guy here has the "Sleaze" move of guys praying on Drunk Girls at the Pub/Club, unfortunately some people are that far in a F$%ed up magnetic field with their moral compass that they can't see right and wrong anymore or choose not too.

The cane, belt, jug cord or whatever else you had need not be applied as i had nothing but "The spoon" (Don't lock her up

) and being the bastard child i was after laughing that off (After a while!) mum just used to talk to me.

I cannot explain how proud i am of who my mum has made me when it comes to subjects like these, a some peoples stance on the issues in front of groups of other men makes my stomach cringe and my blood boil.

Honestly i don't think anything can be done but better parenting and education at home (This should not have to be a school issue!) but the sad truth is the morals in this county by majority seem to be falling in a hole.

**Polyal** · 29-10-2009, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTGTP

Mark - I'm sure Polyal just used the word carelessly. I winced when I saw it myself but a lot of people use the word for many purposes. I feel sure it was referring to something else. Many years ago the word was only used for being happy, then it was used to describe someone's sexual orientation and now used as a modern word for something people do not approve of - without actually making a statement about sexual preferences. My children used it so often that my gay friends got used to it and teased them about it.

Gaela

100% correct, no malicious intended, throw away comment if you will.

Jesk · 29-10-2009, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTGTP

You will find the animal kingdom does not behave like this. They have the rules of nature which is specific to them and abide by that code. Sadly we struggle to achieve this
Gaela

very true, sorry to all the animals i have offended by putting people who have committed such atrocities, they dont even come up to animal level.

sorry i know thats a bit tongue in cheek, but they are sub-human sub-animal they dont deserve to live

**Elks** · 30-10-2009, 01:05 AM

mmmm

Don't really know what to say to add constructively to this discussion. I know if it was one of my girls the guys would seriously have to watch out for speeding WesternStar every time they stepped out. It would likely be parking on there head.

There is some serious moral compass issues. When I was that age I cant imagine any of my mates committing such a deed let alone inviting us along. We would have kicked the (expletive deleted) out of him.

14 other boys who did nothing need to have a long hard look at themselves as well.

2 girls, and 16 boys lives ruined.

My thoughts are for the girls I hope that they recover, and that their family and friends find the strength to support them and not judge them.

GTP 170 · 30-10-2009, 02:06 AM

Im not supporting this act at all, it makes me sick. But I have seen this swing the other way too, I'm 20 and I have two mates that have been charged for statutory rape in recent years when their consenting (but underage) girlfriend's parents found out. One of them was convicted and is now registered as a sex offender, has lost not only his job but very nearly his life from the ordeal.

Another friend is in court at the moment facing multiple rape charges because his perfect christian girl didnt want to admit the truth to daddy.
When he found out she was having sex, she lied and told him she wasn't she was raped. My friend will now loose everything but no amount of pleading will stop the girl or her father, even though both were over 18 at the time of the incidents.

Because of this I tend to take these stories with a grain of salt once the media has caught hold of them, 'gang rape' makes a much better headline than 'lying teenager gets others in trouble'. Im not saying these disgusting things dont happen, or that any girl deserves this treatment in anyway.

Its a complete loss of morals and honour for one's self and others.

It personally makes me nervous to take a girl home on the weekends, i wonder what the consequences will be come monday, and i know others that feel the same way

As for people that cant imagine their friends ever doing anything like this, well i believe freindships are formed between people with similar beliefs and opinions. If I thought any of myfriends had the potential to do something like this they wouldnt be my friend.

bluestreak · 30-10-2009, 03:28 AM

Well, where do you start?

I served in an all-male unit when I was in the Navy and I now work in a male dominated industry. I object to the broad brushing of groups where this sort of thing has occurred. These miscreants did this themselves, not the organisation.

I’ve seen situations that could easily have ended up like this - but the outcomes were determined by the dynamics of the group. ie, the dominant members of the pack were level headed and we nipped it in the bud. Pack mentality cannot be understood by anyone who has not experienced it. Once you succumb to it, unless you are one of the level headed ones, there is no thought of consequences, especially when alcohol is involved. It doesn’t matter how severe the penalties are, they won’t act as a deterrent because you're not thinking that far ahead.

I've always had high respect for women, but my personal belief is that this cr@p started with the push for equality. I’m all for it, but militant feminism has a lot to answer for. Gone are the days when a man would always hold a door open for a women, or similar gestures of chilvalry. Feminists decried these acts as sexist and set about vilifying them, but they missed the point. It wasn’t about inequality – it was about respect. It was respectful to hold open doors, or chairs, or to stand when women left the table etc. Not just women, but elders, and “betters” too. It almost never happens now, or at least I don’t see it happening.

If respect is not taught, at home or at school, how are kids supposed to know their behaviour is wrong?

It has only spiralled out of control since then as others have said, with sex in advertising and on telly and music clips, and easy access to graphic hardcore violent and demeaning porn etc. Listen to any hip hop or R’n’B lyrics – all b7tches an hos and flick the police. Kids think it’s cool.

Further, what’s gone wrong with the girls themselves? They seem to have very little respect for themselves. They put themselves in risky situations without thought that it could all go wrong. I’ve seen it in my own daughter. Her response? Everyone else is doing it. She’s 16 and if she want’s to move out and shack up with her deadbeat no hoper boyfriend there’s nothing we can do to stop her. Certainly nothing we can tell her. I could easily see her getting into this situation. It’s only after something goes wrong that she’ll listen and understand. It keeps me up. Her friends are all the same.

Whether male or female I hold grave fears for Gen Y - as a whole they don't seem to have any understanding of responsibility or consequences.

One thing I’d like to see introduced in Australia(but never will), is something they do in certain European countries where alcohol and drugs are considered aggravating factors(not mitigating). ie, if you did something under the influence of drugs or alcohol, the penalty is harsher because these things impair your judgement. You have to prove you weren't drunk/high, and drugs and drink no longer excuse you from doing stuff.

Hanging the lowlifes that do this stuff is fine after the event, but girls must protect themselves by not putting themselves in that situation in the first place. I'm not judging them, or saying they deserved it - they don't. But we don't always get what we deserve, or deserve what we get.

How do we fix it? Not quickly or easily.

Cheers